YourBigEvent 0 Posted January 7, 2004 Report Share Posted January 7, 2004 That's nearly 2000w of headroom !! Next purchase should be some speakers to match the amp I think .....but what do I know ? Your Big Event Office:01803 813540 Direct: 0797 0717 448 e.mail:info@yourbigevent.co.uk Link to post Share on other sites
Shaun M 0 Posted January 7, 2004 Report Share Posted January 7, 2004 you must remember that a lot of power will be lost in heat. I have another post similar to this one in the main DJ section of this forum. KEEP IT JBL Link to post Share on other sites
YourBigEvent 0 Posted January 7, 2004 Report Share Posted January 7, 2004 It would have to be bloody hot to 'lose' 2000w !! http://www.dj-forum.co.uk/html/emoticons/tongue.gif .....but what do I know ? Your Big Event Office:01803 813540 Direct: 0797 0717 448 e.mail:info@yourbigevent.co.uk Link to post Share on other sites
ChrisPointon 0 Posted January 7, 2004 Author Report Share Posted January 7, 2004 Even a class A Valve amp wouldn't Lose half that!. http://www.dj-forum.co.uk/html/emoticons/fear.gif. Perhaps i'm going about it wrong, maybe I should sell 500W Amplifiers with PC Speakers as a package they'll be fine as long as you are "Careful". http://www.dj-forum.co.uk/html/emoticons/071.gif Link to post Share on other sites
YourBigEvent 0 Posted January 7, 2004 Report Share Posted January 7, 2004 I'll buy a set !!, active or passive ? .....but what do I know ? Your Big Event Office:01803 813540 Direct: 0797 0717 448 e.mail:info@yourbigevent.co.uk Link to post Share on other sites
Loz 0 Posted January 7, 2004 Report Share Posted January 7, 2004 Yeh I know what you're saying, and I know it's very risky but the difference in price from a 1500w to a 2600w was only £60 so I thought it would be a good investment for the future. I did actually go with the intentions of upgrading my speakers but they were a bit expensive at the moment. I was offered some second hand speakers made by a company called "Pure concept audio" the guy said they were the best speakers he had in the whole room, has anyone ever heard of them and if so what they like? Party to the Max, With Happy Traxx Link to post Share on other sites
YourBigEvent 0 Posted January 7, 2004 Report Share Posted January 7, 2004 900w for £60......What make from Japan is it .....but what do I know ? Your Big Event Office:01803 813540 Direct: 0797 0717 448 e.mail:info@yourbigevent.co.uk Link to post Share on other sites
Loz 0 Posted January 8, 2004 Report Share Posted January 8, 2004 It's made by a company called Peavey which I think are American are'nt they? Party to the Max, With Happy Traxx Link to post Share on other sites
DJshaggy 0 Posted January 8, 2004 Report Share Posted January 8, 2004 QUOTE (Loz @ Jan 8 2004, 07:46 AM)It's made by a company called Peavey which I think are American are'nt they? QUOTE they are american but have their own european factory near where i live in northants If it aint got that Swing, it Dont mean a thing!! Link to post Share on other sites
ChrisPointon 0 Posted January 8, 2004 Author Report Share Posted January 8, 2004 What's the model number of the amplifier? (Usually tells you on the front or the specification plate on the back). QUOTE I was offered some second hand speakers made by a company called "Pure concept audio" the guy said they were the best speakers he had in the whole room He's a good salesman http://www.dj-forum.co.uk/html/emoticons/rolleyes.gif QUOTE has anyone ever heard of them and if so what they like? Never heard off them. A search on Google didn't bring up anything either which is strange if they were "that" good. Maybe some of the others have info on them http://www.dj-forum.co.uk/html/emoticons/533.gif Link to post Share on other sites
Ian Stuart 0 Posted January 8, 2004 Report Share Posted January 8, 2004 Sorry, never heard of Pure Concept Audio but I'm happy to confirm that Peavey are legit and (in my humble opinion) make good quality products. I'd recommend some Peavey Messenger Pro 15's to compliment the amp but then I'm biased as they're what I use.................. http://www.dj-forum.co.uk/html/emoticons/wacko.gif Regards to all Ian Stuart Link to post Share on other sites
Loz 0 Posted January 8, 2004 Report Share Posted January 8, 2004 The amp is a PV-2600 is that what you meant Chris? I've seen the messenger PRO15 cabs, there is also the UL15 series as well, we listened to some of them yesterday and they do sound very punchy and clear. I don't know if to get the pro15's and the subs as well or pay a bit more and get the UL15s which are 500w rms http://www.dj-forum.co.uk/html/emoticons/533.gif Party to the Max, With Happy Traxx Link to post Share on other sites
ChrisPointon 0 Posted January 8, 2004 Author Report Share Posted January 8, 2004 Okay I'm not a PV dealer but it was the one I thought http://www.dj-forum.co.uk/html/emoticons/smile.gif , in which case there is good and bad news. The good news is that your amplifier is only actually rated at 2x 900W RMS into a 4 ohm load, and NOT a 2.6kw as you originally stated. The bad news of course, is that you either jumped to the wrong conclusion as to its power rating, or that the salesperson misled you!. Here are the PV-2600 Specs:- QUOTE Stereo Mode: 4 Ohms: 900 Watts RMS x 2 Stereo Mode: 8 Ohms: 540 Watts RMS x 2 Bridge Mode-Mono: 8 Ohms: 1800 Watts RMS Based on the assumption that you are only using the 1 pair of 8ohm speakers, then your amp will be delivering 540W RMS into each cabinet. Still overloaded if your cabs are only 400W @ 8 ohms, but not as much of a risk as I first thought!. Whilst PV Equipment, is indeed good equipment, thanks to its rugged P.A upbringing http://www.dj-forum.co.uk/html/emoticons/smile.gif , there is a tendency to misquote and exaggerate output figures by dealers and the good old commission based salesmen. If you have been sold this as a 1300W x 2 Amplifier by the shop then you have been seriously misled. It may also be that the salesman quoted 2 Ohm output figures, which again are misleading since this is NOT a 2ohm stable amplifier http://www.dj-forum.co.uk/html/emoticons/excl.gif and even Peavey state:- QUOTE *Not recommended for continuous 2 ohm stereo/4 ohm bridge duty. In reality - you have a 2x 900W Amplifier which is currently delivering only 2x 540W RMS into one pair of cabs. This is still more than enough to cope with all the gigs you are likely to throw at it!, and you won't go far wrong with a Peavey Amp. However I would upgrade to some 600W Cabs or 500W at the bare minimum (with DDT Switched in) as soon as practically possible. Link to post Share on other sites
Paul Smith 0 Posted January 8, 2004 Report Share Posted January 8, 2004 I've heard of 'Audio Concepts' which could be the same company based, I believe, in the Cambridge area. I use one of their amps (AC5000) as a back up or if I tri-amp my system when I use it for the horns. I bought the amp second hand some 3 years ago and never had a problem with it. If the speakers are anything like the amp then I would class them as a budget range rather than 'top of the range' PaulS Link to post Share on other sites
Ian Stuart 0 Posted January 8, 2004 Report Share Posted January 8, 2004 QUOTE I've seen the messenger PRO15 cabs, there is also the UL15 series as well, we listened to some of them yesterday and they do sound very punchy and clear. I don't know if to get the pro15's and the subs as well or pay a bit more and get the UL15s which are 500w rms Interetsing..........here we go again with power outage quotes etc. I have had a look on the Peavey website as a result of this post and discovered that my Messenger Pro 15's and Messenger Pro Subs are in fact rated at 500w "program" (whatever that is) and 250w continuous each cab. I had always thought they were 500w each continuous. Ah well........... http://www.dj-forum.co.uk/html/emoticons/533.gif . Question for CP; what is meant by "program"? Anyway, I'm pleased to say that even though they are not as powerful as I thought, they still deliver a lovely tight sound, are plenty loud enough for almost any application and thanks to the crossover built into the sub, driving two 4 ohm speakers a side still means that it's 4 ohms and not the 2 ohms you'd expect it to be ! Hope this helps, regards Ian Stuart Link to post Share on other sites
ChrisPointon 0 Posted January 8, 2004 Author Report Share Posted January 8, 2004 Yep - A lot of manufacturers are guilty of this crime but it's the Americans who tend to favour over selling ratings the most! http://www.dj-forum.co.uk/html/emoticons/scared.gif . Peak / Program are much the same figures. Always consider the RMS / Continuous figures since these are the figures which actually mean something. Peak / Program / PMPO - are figures which can be handled by the speakers for very brief periods of time. What periods of time depend on the manufacturer but they never seem to openly give it away http://www.dj-forum.co.uk/html/emoticons/smile.gif . On average it could be around a few second bursts such as loud peaks or heavy bass passages certainly never more than a few minutes and not an entire gig. RMS / Continuous / RMS Continuous - Accurate figures that your speaker will handle continuously for indefinite periods of time without stress / damage or your tweeters overheating. In short pay attention to RMS / Continuous ratings on the speakers and match that to the RMS Rating of your Amp. Therefore with regard to the PRO15's - if he has already got 400W RMS speakers he would (power wise) by downgrading to the 250W Rating of the Messengers!. They certainly may be a better sounding speaker with better SPL figures but at the end of the day he risks damaging them when driven from a 540W RMS Amplifier. I've repaired speakers which have literally being overdriven so much that the power resistors on the crossovers have got so hot, that they've scorched the pcb and melted the solder contact from pad and the resistor has literally fallen off the PCB. This would usually be the result of connecting a 500W Program Speaker to a 500W RMS amplifier and running at full power all night http://www.dj-forum.co.uk/html/emoticons/excl.gif . With regard to this debate, it is a common conclusion that RMS are the more accurate figure which can be backed up from around the net on Car / AV / P.A Sites, some linked examples are below. Sites which state differently are usually manufacturer based, where they are trying to sell a speaker on its peak rating!. LINK 1 Link 2 The More Useful link Either way - don't believe what the salesman tells you - until you get the chance to check it out for yourself. It usually costs a small fortune in the long run, and remember that Speaker Warranties are a very grey area and don't cover damage caused by poor sales advice. Link to post Share on other sites
Ian Stuart 0 Posted January 8, 2004 Report Share Posted January 8, 2004 Thanks for that Chris, very imformative. http://www.dj-forum.co.uk/html/emoticons/tongue.gif Ian Stuart. Link to post Share on other sites
jackwabbit 0 Posted January 8, 2004 Report Share Posted January 8, 2004 Peavey seem to have a strange way of measuring the wattage of their speakers My son has a pair of ST15’s these are rated as: 150w RMS 300w Program 600w Peak Running these through a 2 X 120w RMS amp they sound great & they have plenty of output. I have read that some people regard a small system like this as “only good for a bedroom DJ-ing but this has handled groups of up to 250 with ease” Their Pro 15’s are rated as: 250w RMS 500w Program 1000w Peak And their UL15’s are rated at: 500w RMS 1000w Program 2000w Peak Chris, You stated that Program is the same as peak, are Peavey pulling a fast one with their figures ? I would add Peaveys web site BUT I don’t want to raise Chris P’s blood pressure. Link to post Share on other sites
ChrisPointon 0 Posted January 8, 2004 Author Report Share Posted January 8, 2004 As above - always read the RMS Figures. Running a 150W RMS Speaker from an Amp channel giving 120W RMS is perfectly okay and allowing 30W RMS headroom is a reasonable safety margin for this level of wattage. Many people are under the impression that they need to buy an entire new P.A system to make their existing one louder and capable of doing larger venues. This is not always the case. Remember that you can add more power and flexibility to your system simply by adding another pair of 8 ohm speakers to your existing ones. For instance an amp delivering 300W RMS @ 8 Ohms and 500W @ 4 Ohms. With only one pair of 8 ohm speakes connected, the total power RMS output is 600W. Add another pair of suitably rated 8 ohm speakers and the total power output is increased to 1000W RMS. Thats an increase of 400W RMS simply by adding an additional pair of speakers. The most efficient way of doing this is by using a pair of subs and 15" Full range cabs at larger venes. Then just using the Full range cabs on their own for smaller venues. Link to post Share on other sites
YourBigEvent 0 Posted January 12, 2004 Report Share Posted January 12, 2004 BUY POWERED SPEAKERS http://www.dj-forum.co.uk/html/emoticons/tongue.gif .....but what do I know ? Your Big Event Office:01803 813540 Direct: 0797 0717 448 e.mail:info@yourbigevent.co.uk Link to post Share on other sites
NineLives 0 Posted January 13, 2004 Report Share Posted January 13, 2004 QUOTE (ADS Entertainments @ Jan 12 2004, 09:35 PM) BUY POWERED SPEAKERS http://www.dj-forum.co.uk/html/emoticons/tongue.gif I see Mackie promote their speakers as Active , is this better than the cheaper plastic budget ones advertised as powered ? Link to post Share on other sites
jackwabbit 0 Posted January 13, 2004 Report Share Posted January 13, 2004 QUOTE (ADS Entertainments @ Jan 12 2004, 09:35 PM) BUY POWERED SPEAKERS http://www.dj-forum.co.uk/html/emoticons/tongue.gif We did think along those lines, but after hearing a pair of plastic speakers we decided against them. Link to post Share on other sites
nrgize 0 Posted June 4, 2004 Report Share Posted June 4, 2004 Thanks for the Info Chris. I always get a little confused with the Ohms ratings,a dn power ratings. So have always got speakers that mach exactly to the amp. The info you have given helps me and might not need to buy another amp to run another pair of speakers to improve on power. Cheers http://www.dj-forum.co.uk/html/emoticons/biggrin.gif Email :: info@nrgize-disco.co.uk Link to post Share on other sites
Paul Forsyth 0 Posted June 12, 2004 Report Share Posted June 12, 2004 http://www.dj-forum.co.uk/html/emoticons/fear.gif OK - advice needed please!!!! I am currenly running a pair of Peavey Eurosys 500xt's with a Numark Dimension 3 amp - With the amp volume at 50% and the mixer near full the amp is clipping. The amp runs 475W RMS @4 ohms The speakers 500W program / 1000W peak (No RMS rating given - but I suspect they might be 250W RMS) The amp does have a Low Cut Filter but I don't know if this will help the clipping situation. All advice welcome Also what would be the best way to get more volume - mainly all age functions / weddings - would I be better off getting another pair of matching speakers and link them or adding sub woofers ? or would I be better off buying a more powerful pair to run on their own? Sorry for all these questions - ps not alot to spend immediately Thanks http://www.dj-forum.co.uk/html/emoticons/thumbup.gif Vinnie Paul Forsyth The DJ formally known as Vinnie Link to post Share on other sites
mikeee 0 Posted June 12, 2004 Report Share Posted June 12, 2004 Has the clipping always been there with this configuration? From your description, I would say you have a mis-match between the mixing and amp. What is the output from the mixer (1.2v?) and what is the input of the amp (0.775v?). If the figures in brackets are what you have, then the mixer is overloading the input of the amp - bingo - lots of unwanted crap. Does the mixer have swithable outputs (0.5v, 0.775v. 1.0v, 1.2v, 1.5v), if so start with the lowest setting. There is a chance that you may at some point damaged the speakers, nothing like a damaged horn to make the system sound like rubbish. Also try turning all the mixer levels to zero, put the amp on full, then ease the levels on the mixer up a little bit at a time and see what the does My 2 watts worth ..playing all the hits for you... ....whether you may be.... Why can't I see what i going on??? Link to post Share on other sites
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