The Bose PAS Preview

[Paul Smith 0]

The BOSE PAS was 1st brought to my attention on this forum by Richard (Rendezvous). Since then I know that several members here have purchased one (or more) and my various excursions on the net to research this system got me thinking that it was worth looking (listening) into further.

 

On Friday I travelled to the only BOSE shop we have here and asked the smiling shop assistant if I could have a demo of the PAS. ‘What’s that?’’ he asked. ‘It stands for Personalised Amplification System’’ I said returning his smile http://www.dj-forum.co.uk/html//emoticons/wacko.gif

 

‘Don’t know it’ he said ‘Is it from the Pro Range?’ - ‘Yes’ I replied, already realising that my journey was in vain. He spoke to his colleague who had heard of it but told me that they only do home entertainment at that shop. He also said that he knew of one customer that had travelled to the USA about 18 months ago to preview it and subsequently brought one back with him.

 

Anyway to cut a long story short they gave me the number of BOSE Ireland and when I returned home even though it was 5.30pm on a Friday Bank Holiday weekend I called the number. The person who answered told me that someone would call me back shortly. Ten minutes later I had the contact details of the nearest PAS stockist - some 75 miles away.

 

Saturday PM I saddled up the Vectra and rode out of town http://www.dj-forum.co.uk/html//emoticons/cowboy.gif . 2 hours later, after battling with the Bank Holiday traffic I walked into this music store and my first impression was ‘That sounds sweet’. At that stage I didn’t know what was playing from what (it was a guy singing to a backing track) but as I walked down the shop I recognised the ‘Radiator’ of the PAS and it was obvious that this was where the sound was coming from. I then walked to each area of the shop, which was about the size of a venue that would seat 100, and, sure enough, the sound was as loud in the corners as it was standing right in front of the system.

 

I’ve heard 100’s of PAs during my career and this is not like any one of them. I tracked down a member of staff and asked them to play a CD & turn it up. They played a Bob Marley song and this is only way I can describe it:

 

‘In the late 1980s I heard my very 1st CD, played on a Sony Walkman with Sony headphones and, even though I didn’t know the song, it was like I was there as it was being recorded’. This is the second time when I have been taken aback with sound quality in that way because I did feel that Bob Marley was in that shop http://www.dj-forum.co.uk/html//emoticons/headphone.gif . Anyway I spent the next 2 hours in the shop, not trying to find Bob Marley, but to get to the nitty gritty.

 

So onto the system. The guts are in a base unit (PS1) which was larger than it looks on all the pictures I had seen. In fact when I saw this I thought ‘Why so big?’ http://www.dj-forum.co.uk/html//emoticons/533.gif but can’t think of any reason other than it houses 750 watts RMS in 3 amps and is designed for band use rather than disco (it goes behind the band). I suppose it could go behind the DJ too, The unit is robust plastic and can be stood on (this is recommended by BOSE when inserting and removing the speakers) but it does have a large ‘footprint’. The controls for the amplifiers are at the rear of the PS1 and covered by a rather flimsy flap that opens backwards (I would have preferred the flap to open the other way & protect the inputs/controls etc) from the front.

 

There are 4 inputs - 2 either balanced/unbalanced (jack or XLR) and 2 more unbalanced (jack) The 1st 2 also have the option of assigning them preset values so for instance pre-recorded music would have a value of ‘00’ (or ‘57’ for low volume) and a SM58 mic would use ‘14’ however these are only for direct input of the device and do not really apply when using a mixer. Most of the other presets are for various brands of guitar, double bass, microphones, keyboards etc. Inputs 3 & 4 are 0db lines and are designed for CD players etc.

 

Still with me?? http://www.dj-forum.co.uk/html//emoticons/sleep1.gif The radiator (L1) contains all the mid/high range speakers (24 in total). It splits in 2 which is just as well as it stands over 7 feet tall. The connections are made automatically whenever the unit plugs in to the PS1 and there is a footswitch to release the locking mechanism at the end of the function. There is some movement when the L1 is connected into PS1 - it can sway a couple of inches from left to right and an inch front to back

 

The bass bins (B1) connect to PS1 using 4 way speakon connectors (the extra 2 wires are used by PS1 to determine if 1 or 2 B1s are being used). A lead is supplied with each B1.

 

The system also comes with a wired remote control (complete with Velcro) so that the volume, bass treble and middle can be controlled + the input from the 2 channels can also be balanced. There are 2 LEDs on the remote control unit which change from green to red if the system is overloaded. If a mixer is being used then the remote doesn’t have as much importance however if it is not connected the system uses a default ‘12 0’clock’ position for these controls when the input is on channels 1 & 2.

 

Whilst I was at the shop I helped the salesman unpack and prepare two complete systems. The padded bags for the PS1 were really tight and I managed to break the zip on one whilst trying to close it http://www.dj-forum.co.uk/html//emoticons/oops.gif . The padded bags for the B1s simply slide on and there is a flap to access the handle on the speaker. The radiator splits in 2 and there is a bag for each - be aware that one bag is very slightly larger than the other and the only way to find this out is to lay them together (worth marking I think).

 

Weight wise, because the system breaks down into so many parts, even stairs wouldn’t be a problem. I carried 2 PS1s (16Kg each) for a short distance and it was similar to going on holiday with suitcases. The rest of the system is lighter and I found no problem with 2 x L1s (4 bags - 2 in each hand) for a walk of 20 meters. The B1s are even lighter still.

 

http://www.dj-forum.co.uk/html//emoticons/thumbup.gif Pros.

 

Sound Quality

Sturdy overall construction

Ease of transportation/connection/storage

 

http://www.dj-forum.co.uk/html//emoticons/thumbdown.gif Cons:

 

PS1 bag too small

PS1 itself has a large footprint

Flap on PS1 for controls not protective enough

The bags for the B1s could do with a pocket for the speakon lead

An expensive system

 

My personal opinion is that BOSE have come up with something here that is different & special. It is expensive, however from my enquires it is unlikely to come down in price for some time yet - in fact at the moment demand is exceeding supply (the shop I was in now has a waiting list and during my 2 hours there was a constant stream of people who had heard that this system was on demo and had travelled, like I had, for some distance to hear it in operation). The salesman I was with, who had worked there for some 20 years, had never experienced an interest on this scale in any other product from musicians. (They received their first 12 systems last week and the two I helped to unpack were the last ones reserved and, as I said, they now have a waiting list.).

 

The appliances are made in China (what isn’t these days) and I suppose that eventually another manufacturer will come in with a comparative system at a lower price. How long until that happens though is anyones guess.

 

 

[Award Entertainment 0]

Excellent review. You went into much more detail about the actual system than most and have described the PAS accurately. A couple of comments as an existing owner:

• PS1 bag too small

  The bag eases with use and becomes much easier with time. The L1 bags are the same- too tight when new, but OK with time.

• PS1 itself has a large footprint

  That's to make it tip-proof according to Bose. As you will have noticed, the L1 column isn't a flimsy piece of plastic...

• Flap on PS1 for controls not protective enough

  I couldn't agree enough! That's a common complaint.

• The bags for the B1s could do with a pocket for the speakon lead

  They also need to be 6-sided bags to protect all visible surfaces on the B1 sub. When you have 2 subs, you lie them on their sides, so the scuffed base is visible. I've put small black rubber feet on mine until I get bags made.

• An expensive system

  Thank goodness- otherwise they wouldn't be excusively for DJs and musicians who take their business very seriously!! http://www.dj-forum.co.uk/html//emoticons/smile.gif

As for the sound and the impact it had on you, I felt a familiar deja-vu when reading your comments. The Bose sounds to me like Hi-Fi, compared with all of the other powered sound systems I've heard which sound like PA. Edited April 30, 2006 by Rendezvous

[RichardP 0]

Good review, thanks for that!

 

The idea of these things is certainly growing on me. Especially as my current car doesn't have enough room for (what I'd call) decent conventional speakers!

 

To a certain extent it's useful reading other people's opinions on these things, but I've got to check these things out for myself especially as audio reproduction can be subjective. I'm looking forward to hearing a demo so I can hear for myself how in particular it conveys dance music dynamics and characteristics in terms of weight/slam/punchiness, evenness of response etc.

 

[As an aside, anyone have any experience of Nexo PS range?]

[transeurope 0]

QUOTE (Rendezvous @ Apr 30 2006, 07:37 AM)

[*]An expensive system Thank goodness- otherwise they wouldn't be excusively for DJs and musicians who take their business very seriously!! http://www.dj-forum.co.uk/html//emoticons/smile.gif

You know something?

 

Even though I admire a lot of what Richard says, let me put this into perspective.

 

Last night, owing to circumstances, I had to use one of the crummiest of crummy systems and got great feedback.

 

I value my customers enough to use a better-specced system normally.

 

Obviously though Bose don't quite value me enough. They can't make flaps right. They can't make bags right.

 

I don't see this as an exclusivity thing.

 

I see this as an exploitation thing.

 

BMWs don't come with flimsy trim.

 

 

If I took the Bose attitude to life, then I wouldn't bother buying a BOSE at all, because the other systems "did the job", just like their trim "does the job".

 

I am sorry, but I find BOSE very unhelpful with all kinds of support and availability issues.

 

Work harder Bose if you want to be supplier to the best.

[Kingy 0]

QUOTE (Rendezvous @ Apr 30 2006, 07:37 AM)

[*]An expensive system Thank goodness- otherwise they wouldn't be excusively for DJs and musicians who take their business very seriously!! http://www.dj-forum.co.uk/html//emoticons/smile.gif

RICHARD!!!

 

What sort of tripe is this comment??????

 

I have three, no four systems all costing at least the price of the BOSE system and ..............

 

Forget it! http://www.dj-forum.co.uk/html//emoticons/wallbash.gif http://www.dj-forum.co.uk/html//emoticons/wallbash.gif http://www.dj-forum.co.uk/html//emoticons/wallbash.gif

[Steve_Mitchell 0]

well done Paul. I`ll stick with my Mackie`s and the £1k + in my pocket..

[Award Entertainment 0]

Kingy, it was CLEARLY meant as a joke! That's what the little smiley is there for. http://www.dj-forum.co.uk/html//emoticons/huh.gif

 

For what it's worth, I feel that the Bose PAS is a bargain and I almost wish it was a little more expensive to keep it as a point of difference between myself and other New Zealand DJs. It's a few hundred pounds cheaper here in New Zealand for each side incidentally. It's rendered my Mackies completely obsolete and they haven't been out of their bags since I got my PAS. They'll be on the market in the next couple of weeks, along with my powered sub.

[Jason v G 0]

After many phonecalls, visits etc to a local bose supplier near me ( a guitar shop) I eventually managed to get to hear the bose pas with 2 bass units for myself just last thursday.

 

WOW !!

 

I think it actually took me a whole 1 minute and an wander round the (cluttered with guitars) shop to decide to buy.

The reaction from the musician types in the store as well as the staff was one which I can only describe as disbelief.

It's gonna be a preference thing, try it you may like it, don't try it and you'll never know.

Me ? I'm hooked!

 

[BigBen 0]

Excellent review Paul, thank you very much for taking the time to post such a wonderful commentary on your adventures.

 

I keep meaning to ask this question...do any of you, or would any of you, who already own this system use it at home in a domestic capacity as well as for gigs? In other words, would you connect the Bose to your hi-fi when you return from a gig?

 

If not, why not?

[Jimbo55 0]

The Pas is another way of doing the job. It will suit some but not others. Cost V's quality is subjective. The Pas was originally intended for Live Musicians. In this respect, for portability V's sound quality there is no equal as the sound is controlled by the artist. Set up correctly it does away with a whole array of other equipment. It is not 'magic' nor is it a cure for 'what ails thee' but it does go a long way. It is a matched system and Bose have used this to good effect. There are many possible configurations with the system. People are assuming that it is a complete system (and It is) and can only be used as one unit. The PS1 is in fact three seperate amps that can be used to power ordinary speakers (4 ohms min) that has avariable preset Eq system on two input channels. You also do not have to bose B1's but can use any Bass Bin (250w 4 ohm).

 

For the Dj.

I think it will take time to adjust to the way the Pas works. It is not perfect nor is it bullet proof. Have used my double system 4 times I have yet to fully explore its capabilities. Certainly for ease of set up it wins hands down. Yes the PS1 has a large footprint but nowhere near as large as a speaker tripod stand. The PS1 bags are tight but mine have worn in already. Bose state quite clearly that the bags can be left on while in use.

 

Now the sound. You have to hear it. It is as simple as that. Make up your own mind.

 

Mine is NOT going back. (45 day trial period)

 

I used mine in the house. http://www.dj-forum.co.uk/html//emoticons/thumbup.gif all through the house without being loud. Family BBQ tomorrow one in the house and one in the garden (wifes birthday 21 again and again etc).

 

Jimbo

 

[brianmole 0]

I had a couple of honeys pole dance on on of mine tonight http://www.dj-forum.co.uk/html//emoticons/laugh.gif Tough decision, enjoy the show and sacrifice the PAS, or chase them away http://www.dj-forum.co.uk/html//emoticons/drool.gif

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I enjoyed the show for a short mo, then asked them niceley to step off http://www.dj-forum.co.uk/html//emoticons/thumbup.gif

[ChrisPointon 0]

Also remember that any sound system is only as good as the weakest link in the chain http://www.dj-forum.co.uk/html//emoticons/smile.gif . So the quality of what you plug into a PA will also to a large extent, dictate what comes out!.

 

BOSE L1 SYSTEM UK SALES

[Eskie 0]

I thought I'd add my feelings on the Bose PAS as I've now had my system for almost a month.

I purchased the double bass system, which is 2 of the sticks (L1's) and 4 of the subs (B1's). As has been pointed out by many people the sound is superb and in the few weeks that I've had it I've had more comments about the sound quality than the previous 5 years combined with my JBL's. Also had very positive comments about the look of the system.

However it is not ALL positive as far as I'm concerned. I was amazed that in Jimbo's post above he says that for ease of setup it wins hands down http://www.dj-forum.co.uk/html//emoticons/huh.gif I have no idea what system Jimbo was using previously but for me it now takes far longer to set-up/breakdown than it used to.

Prior to purchasing the PAS for most gigs I would use 2 JBL Eon15 G2's plus 1 JBL Eon15 Sub and 2 speaker stands. Which basically meant 2 trips in, then remove the bag from each speaker, remove the stands from their bag, place the 2 G2's on top of the stands and place the sub under my deck stand. Then a simple job of rigging up the signal & power cables to the 3 speakers.

The PAS involves 4 trips (1 for the 2 power stands (PS1's), 2 trips for the B1's and 1 for the 4 bags which make up the 2 L1's). It then means removing the 4 bags from the B1's and the 4 bags from the L1 components, plus unzipping the bag on the PS1's (I always leave the bag on as it gives a little more protection to the open flap with the inputs/controls), then connecting each of the subs, inserting the 1st part of the L1 into the PS1 and then the 2nd part of the L1 into the other end of the L1 and repeat for the other side. Then connecting signal & power cables and also the cables for the remote plus the remote unit itself.

This whole procedure takes significantly longer than the setup/breakdown for the Eons, especially the breakdown as the bags for the L1's fit extremely snugly so they have to be placed into the bags carefully and then zipped up (repeat 4 times for each of the L1 components).

Obviously using a trolley can reduce some of the trips to/from your vehicle, but then many venues have a stair here and there plus other obstacles which reduce the effectiveness of trolleys.

Don't get me wrong, I am very happy with the Bose PAS and have no intentions of returning it at the end of the 45 day trial but I just want to make it clear to anybody who may be thinking of purchasing one who is thinking that it's very quick to setup/breakdown. If you are currently using powered speakers then the Bose PAS is certainly not quicker or easier... it will probably though, be far better sound quality and will draw more admiring glances from clients and banquet managers.

[Corabar Steve 0]

QUOTE (5star @ Apr 30 2006, 01:43 AM)

There are 4 inputs - 2 either balanced/unbalanced (jack or XLR) and 2 more unbalanced (jack) The 1st 2 also have the option of assigning them preset values so for instance pre-recorded music would have a value of ‘00’ (or ‘57’ for low volume) and a SM58 mic would use ‘14’ however these are only for direct input of the device and do not really apply when using a mixer. Most of the other presets are for various brands of guitar, double bass, microphones, keyboards etc. Inputs 3 & 4 are 0db lines and are designed for CD players etc.

So can you use the XLR input when using a mixer?

[Jimbo55 0]

2x top cabs at 27kgs each. 2x bass bins at 26 kgs each. 2x amps at 17kgs each.

 

Taping and long cable runs now obsolete. I will only use one PAS in most small/akward venues.

 

HSE note..... lifting 25kgs and above requires two persons. These figures are less when you get above knuckle height. HSE recommend that you do not lift more than 10 kgs above shoulder height and 20kgs above elbow height. The weights are less for women. There is a leaflet with a table of weights and relevent heights. See page 16

 

HSE

 

So the PAS is effectivly more than the 'sum of the parts' for me.

 

It splits weight. Keeps me within the law

 

I can use various combinations of the components,.

 

The Bose name.

 

The fact that it is different.

 

The sound.

 

 

Steve

You can use XLR connectors from your mixer to the XLR on channels 1 & 2. You may have to use a 20db in line pad if the output cannot be reduced if it is to high. It will sound harsh and clipped if you do not. Use the 00 preset to allow you the use any eq you may have on board.

 

Jimbo

[brianmole 0]

I have the same setup as Eskie, in my case it takes a little less time to set up as I used to have separate amps and speakers before.

 

Steve, you can use the XLR, but it is supposed to be a mic level. I bought a converter (XLR to 1/4" Jack) which is connected to the balanced line cable, that way you get the best of both worlds - no interference, and optimum line levels into the PAS:

http://www.dancemix.co.uk/images/5650.jpg

[Award Entertainment 0]

I'm so excited to see a bunch of UK DJs getting the pleasure from the PAS that I do. I've had a handful of emails and PMs thanking me for putting you onto the product, so thanks! You know who you are.

 

Mine is definitely quicker to set up and pack down than my Mackies (1 PAS is very equivilant to 2 Mackie SRM450s) and it's physically much, much easier to carry. The strapping and tidying of cables and setting up, packing down and bagging of tripods and SRM450s is now a distant memory, as is the 25kg in each hand up the stairs!

 

BigBen, I do set mine up at home sometimes, but it's a big piece of kit in a domestic environment (7 feet tall), so most wives will have something to say about it. Add to that the fact that I'd hate my 3 and 5 year old boys to damage it...

[transeurope 0]

QUOTE (Jimbo55 @ May 1 2006, 08:38 AM)

HSE note..... lifting 25kgs and above requires two persons. These figures are less when you get above knuckle height. HSE recommend that you do not lift more than 10 kgs above shoulder height and 20kgs above elbow height.

I am sorry, but this, in my experience at least is not true at all.

 

Please see the very leaflet that you referenced:

 

"There is no such thing as a completely ‘safe’ manual handling operation.

But working within the following guidelines will cut the risk and reduce

the need for a more detailed assessment."

 

So "assess" already!

 

"Are you saying I mustn’t exceed the guidelines?

No. The risk assessment guidelines are not ‘safe limits’ for lifting."

 

 

There is waaaaaaaay too much scare talk about all this.

 

As far as I am aware the general EU-sanctioned limit to lifting is that loads over 20kg require an assessment of the person doing the lifting, EVEN IF THAT PERSON HAS REPORTED AS HEALTHY and workers must be offered the option of refusing to lift that load. Loads of more than 30kg require an assessment of the load, circumstances and person doing the lifting.

 

These regulations are based on these limits.

 

ALL materials handling MUST take account of what happens when a likely accident happens.

 

The rules are strict enough (with good reason) already. Let's not go overboard here.

 

What happens when you try to ship a parcel with UPS over 30kg? They put a sticker on it. They don't refuse to ship it and the driver still delivers it. From a big truck. Lifting in full effect.

 

 

 

Let's have some common sense back in this debate.

[Paul Smith 0]

QUOTE (brianmole @ May 1 2006, 01:48 AM)

I had a couple of honeys pole dance on on of mine tonight http://www.dj-forum.co.uk/html//emoticons/laugh.gif Tough decision, enjoy the show and sacrifice the PAS, or chase them away http://www.dj-forum.co.uk/html//emoticons/drool.gif

Yes - forget the sound quality - it's really a phallic symbol http://www.dj-forum.co.uk/html//emoticons/biggrin.gif

[transeurope 0]

You see I am having difficulty with this thread because I don't really see anything USEFUL in all of this.

 

Different, yes, useful no.

 

Back in the 80s, BOSE was taking over the world with their 802s, their Acoustimas, their "system controller", their panoramic sound etc etc.

 

And they were everywhere, from Tescos to chav car hi-fis.

 

And it was brilliant marketing. And if I had shares in Bose I would be really happy.

 

And what happened? People woke up and smelled the coffee.

 

Bose is a shadow of its former self now.

 

What's this though? Panoramic sound? Exclusive marketing? "Easy" setup. Let's throw in a few health and safety regs while we are at it.

 

People stopped using BOSE in the 80s because they found out what DJs in the 70s found out. Multiple arrays of small speakers sound sweet at low volume, but when you have to cut through a crowd (note I am NOT saying playing a rave) they just don't cut it.

 

People will be fooled some of the time, but let them hear a few Turbo rigs, a few EAW rigs and soon they begin to tire of the BOSE novelty.

 

People were fooled by BOSE amplifiers with their "cascading" VU displays but soon they will come to realise that they are just the same ole Hill Audio amps sold at three times the price, with all of the issues of Hill Audio, but appalling backup service.

 

I don't see anything new here. Bose know how to market very small speakers that are impossible to set up by putting the exclusive badge on them.

 

Quality and useability were always lacking and all I am seeing is "here we go again".

 

 

 

 

[Paul Smith 0]

QUOTE (transeurope @ May 1 2006, 03:54 PM)

You see I am having difficulty with this thread because I don't really see anything USEFUL in all of this.

http://www.dj-forum.co.uk/html//emoticons/533.gif You don't find anything USEFUL in the thread or USEFUL in the product

[Dukesy 0]

That is a very good question Paul.

I would guess he means product. http://www.dj-forum.co.uk/html//emoticons/hide.gif

By the way, a very good and open review sir. http://www.dj-forum.co.uk/html//emoticons/thumbup.gif

 

As a product, apart from the obvious price tag, many seem to be praising the PAS.

 

Q) Is it possible that a product that was essentially launched for the 'serious', bands, etc could gradually turn mobile DJs into the very beast often criticised ?

Many mobile DJs on here have criticised and stated some bands as already being arrogant and up their own ass or snobs......imagine the bands attitude with these beauty's ?! http://www.dj-forum.co.uk/html//emoticons/laugh.gif

YIKES! http://www.dj-forum.co.uk/html//emoticons/scared.gif http://www.dj-forum.co.uk/html//emoticons/fright.gif http://www.dj-forum.co.uk/html//emoticons/biggrin.gif

 

But seriously folks.....all jokes aside, I have managed to ask three different bands (members) about these Bose speakers during the course of the last few weeks.

 

All three hadn't heard of them and questioned the Bose name immediately!

I went on to explain the 'superb quality' already mentioned by users, etc, etc.

The same reply came back from all the guys. Who uses them? How much, and will it increase the income?! On a serious point, some agreed why lose the rich sound of dedicated speakers, and went further to say similar comments Transeurope has made. Spot on TEE!

All said they would have a look if they had the time but from they way they replied indicated a unified 'I'll stick with the current rig thanks!"

 

Q) Do mobile DJs essentially get repeat work from their ability to DJ, or because of the lighting or sound system used, or overall appearance of the disco?

 

I don't know how many will agree but when a mobile DJ does a private function and earns £XXX for 'X' amount of hours, I seriously doubt that any mobile DJ or entertainer would earn wads of extra £££'s just on these type of speakers, or on equipment designed in Area 51, or because the equipment even looked neat and tidy, used DMX or had low power consumption lighting, etc, etc.

Maybe and essentially the mobile DJs ability and the 'performance', perhaps yes?

Maybe, everything else is secondary?

 

I honestly believe that mobile DJs for a long, long time realise that to be 'service focused' as opposed to being 'product focused' gives a far better return long term!

 

Yes, we as mobile DJs need reliable equipment to do the job but the customer (who generally do not book DJs every day) wouldn't give the slightest thought to what gear we have, they essentially just want an affordable top quality DJ - everything else is a bonus to them!

 

If a mobile DJ wishes to buy a thousand pound microphone, or a speaker system that sounds absolutely beautiful for loads of pounds, euros' or dollars - I say good luck to them, but feet on terra firma and honest to themselves, probably won't see an overnight change in income and will still probably charge a client exactly or similar to what they have charged before.....

 

Q) Would a marketing empathises of "I have a piece of equipment that has to be seen or heard to be believed" seriously sway the client on the end of the phone if all they want is a price and availability check for a function on date 'X'?

 

Perhaps I'm totally wrong in my tongue in cheek assessment, but honestly, it must respectfully be each to their own! http://www.dj-forum.co.uk/html//emoticons/biggrin.gif

 

[Eskie 0]

QUOTE (discodirect @ May 2 2006, 01:00 AM)

The same reply came back from all the guys. Who uses them? How much, and will it increase the income?! On a serious point, some agreed why lose the rich sound of dedicated speakers, and went further to say similar comments Transeurope has made. Spot on TEE!

Spot on about what!? his post appeared nothing more than a mindless negative rant about Bose, almost suggesting that he has had some sort of bitter experience in the past with a Bose product or the company itself and has now decided that anything they produce is rubbish! There was no reasoned argument about the product in question just a lot of twaddle about what they used to be like. There was no mention of having actually listened to the PAS, so to say he was spot on seems inane to me http://www.dj-forum.co.uk/html//emoticons/wacko.gif

A few experienced DJs have indicated that they feel it's a very good product and meets their needs (myself included) "Tee" has totally dismissed these opinions and given all of them a total lack of respect with some of his ranting above!

[transeurope 0]

It was the product I was criticising, not the thread in general.

 

I actually found your review interesting 5Star, if only because it confirmed that Bose still can't properly make a premium product in my opinion. I accept that wasn't your intention but your "fair review" did include that information, in what was generally a favourable impression of the Bose.

 

Can we get our feet back on Terra Firma folks?

 

This is the company that marketed Hill Audio amps, made in the UK, as a decent enough budget amp as "Bose Amps". They charged three times the price of the exact equal Hill Audio product. Bose know how to screw a few quid out of branding.

 

These amps did go through a bad patch in 1987. Their protect mode would engage for no apparent reason. Bose blamed the user. It COULDN'T be Bose after all!

 

If you called Hill Audio and did not mention that it was a Bose amp that you had the problem with, they acknowledged the faulty batch. But if you mentioned Bose they clamped up immediately and said they weren't allowed discuss it.

 

Stick your head in any disco bar in the 80s and what was on the wall? Bose 802s! They had the most successful saturation of the market ever accomplished in the history of disco. Do you see any on the walls of disco bars now? Certainly not many. Does that tell you something?

 

When put up against a crowd all that nice sweet sound just becomes white noise.

 

So this company, which yes, I did have very bitter experience of in the late 80s, thank you very much, what does this company say is the suggested application of the PAS?

 

It says that the suggested application is an acoustic musician performing to approx 200 people. Read their own material!

 

It says that a cabaret band (more like a disco) could also use it...IF EACH AND EVERY MEMBER OF THE BAND USES ONE SYSTEM EACH!!!!!!

 

So that's like 5-7 PAS on a stage for a typical wedding band.

 

C'mon, this is supposed to be a substitute for a real PA?

 

It's main advantage (and I have to grant it is a good one) is that for a solo acoustic player they no longer need a monitor for playing to a small audience. That's neat trick.

 

Not even BOSE say this is for a disco. Where on the website do they recommend DJs use it? They recommend that they use 802s! And even they have a pretty sorry reputation in this business.

 

This is the closest they come to saying it's for DJs:

QUOTE

Can a DJ use the new system for recorded music? Yes, but many of the weaknesses of the conventional approach remain.

 

I don't need to try a Fiat Bambino to know that I can't fit my rig in it.

I don't need to try a speaker system that BOSE themselves say is not designed for DJs to know that it's ummm not for DJs.

 

What can I say to Eskie? Where did I personally attack him?

 

Am I wrong to be suspicious of BOSE products? Are the literally millions of people who paid top dollar for them in the 80s and then fled the brand wrong? Did I and hundreds of other people imagine this amp defect? Are we wrong to be annoyed?

 

What does this product bring to the table, apart from stereo imaging that cannot be accomplised by any small speaker, which are by nature directional, good at midrange and light?

 

Have you compared them to other small speakers? From HK or FBT or KME or any premium brand? I know you didn't say you did, but isn't our role here on these forums to get real? Why all the hype about one poorly finished, expensive, over-hyped system?

 

The bottom line is that DJing is one of those jobs where heavy gear is often required. That's a fact of life. The safety implications of this are not extreme, they should just be borne in mind.

 

If you need a small speaker, any small speaker will produce directional, mid range sound. That is a fact.

 

All this has been known for years. All that's new in this design is only of interest to those musicians who are tied for space both onstage and in the car and need monitor.

 

 

[Dukesy 0]

QUOTE

inane

 

Eskie, to class my comment in the same context as meaning ridiculous, idiotic, stupid, mindless, childish and immature comes across to me as a little more than discourteous, or am I wrong? Why insinuate I was justifying the whole of TEE’s post.

 

It’s not rocket FFS! http://www.dj-forum.co.uk/html//emoticons/laugh.gif

 

Regardless of the post content being construed or accepted ‘twaddle’ by you or anyone else, TEE concisely echoed 200% of same and similar comments I received from the band members of which I simply acknowledged.

 

The band members stated that a personal amplification system based on the info I gave would not be ideal for their band.

Whilst they said that they appreciated that there may indeed be a reduction in gear if maybe 5 or 6 systems were purchased, they insisted they still would not buy it, commenting on the expenditure alone (based on the info I gave) and seriously doubting that one system used on stage would produce the same results in a 200-300+ crowd venue (handling) or 'cut it' the same as what they currently use.

HOWEVER, they did joke that with less gear to ferry around, they could save on the odd beer crate expense for the roadies! http://www.dj-forum.co.uk/html//emoticons/biggrin.gif

Their comments (I understood at the time) indicated a level of experience with speakers or at the very least a good familiarity.

 

I know nothing of line array systems and am no expert in acoustical physics but they (the band members) gave me an interesting insight and background on why PA speakers are very important to their livelihood, pointed out that subjective tests of a speaker system in a gig environment is one thing, but that objective ‘blind tests’ against other similar systems would be more ideal, and kindly gave me a head up on a few names worth looking into around the same quoted price tag and lower.

 

We chatted for ages (well it seemed like it at the time) I received a lecture about the intrinsic value of conventional speaker design; the background on the speakers I use, and mentioning none other than the same Eastern Acoustic Works systems and 'Turbo' system rigs Transeurope mentioned, stories of rigs at Brixton Academy, Castle Donnington, Knebworth House and other references to which, as an experienced DJ and former live musician myself, I appreciated, acknowledged and respected.

 

Another comment mentioned was that not all speakers work for everyone.

I’ll go along with that.