Pioneer CDJ-1000 MK3

[RichardP 0]

I think the trouble is that technically under consumer law, if you send a product back for 'repair' on the first occasion and they return it 'repaired', you have waived your rights to send it back for refund at a later time - they are only obliged to 'repair' it again for the duration of warranty period.

 

That's why it's best to request a refund on the first occasion and start again (or even insist on a brand new replacement and a full restart of warranty).

 

I'd now return it to them immediately with a letter stating that it's unfit for the purpose for which it was intended and requesting a full refund for that player. Get a record of the receipt of the unit.

 

If paid for by credit card (hope it was!) then contact the CC company immediately to inform them that you dispute the amount on your statement (deduct the price of the deck accordingly for the proper adjusted price) for the reason stated abouve. They will likely send you forms asking for more info for their investigation.

 

You may also find these people to be very helpful in this kind of process:

 

http://www.consumerdirect.gov.uk/

 

Stick to your guns, hold your nerve and good luck http://www.dj-forum.co.uk/html//emoticons/smile.gif

[milhouse 0]

QUOTE (RichardP @ Jun 26 2006, 04:16 PM)

If paid for by credit card (hope it was!) then contact the CC company immediately to inform them that you dispute the amount on your statement (deduct the price of the deck accordingly for the proper adjusted price) for the reason stated abouve. They will likely send you forms asking for more info for their investigation. You may also find these people to be very helpful in this kind of process: http://www.consumerdirect.gov.uk/ Stick to your guns, hold your nerve and good luck  http://www.dj-forum.co.uk/html//emoticons/smile.gif

It most certainly was paid for on credit card! http://www.dj-forum.co.uk/html//emoticons/biggrin.gif

 

They have arranged a free collection of the unit tomorrow morning, in which I will include a letter asking for a refund as the unit is unfit for purpose, as you suggest... and see how I get on with that.

 

That consumer direct website says:

 

Rejecting faulty goods

 

You have a right to 'reject' faulty goods. If you tell the seller promptly that the goods are faulty and you don't want them, you should be able to get your money back. As long as you have not legally 'accepted' the goods, you can still 'reject' them - that is, refuse to accept them.

 

One of the ways you accept goods is by keeping them after you've had a reasonable time to examine them, and without clearly saying that you want to return them. What is 'reasonable', however, is not fixed - it depends on the circumstances. Normally, you can at least take your purchase home and try it out. But if you delay in examining what you've bought or in telling the seller that you wish to reject the goods, then you might lose your right to reject.

 

Even if you signed an 'acceptance note', this does not mean you have signed away your right to reject the goods.

 

If you agree to let the seller try to put faulty goods right, this also does not affect your rights. Make it clear that if the repair fails, you will be rejecting the goods and seeking a refund.

 

So it looks like I have a good leg to stand on:)

[RichardP 0]

Good to hear http://www.dj-forum.co.uk/html//emoticons/smile.gif

 

Somewhere on that consumer direct website there's an online form you can fill out and someone phones you to advise further.

 

The last time I used them they offered to send me an example of the wording to use in correspondence - you may also possibly find that useful.

[Gary 0]

Not more Mk3 issues

 

Want me to help you find a nice price on a pair of Denon DN-S3500's?...?

 

Is the problem repeatable, 100% of the time? If so, I'd be down to Sapphires with the unit that Pioneer say is ok, and the unit that hasn't been repaired yet and show them a dozen discs that will always play in "A" but not in "B".

 

If you can afford to be without it, care to send me the Rhianon disc to try on 7 or 8 other units by way of comparison?

 

If Sapph's wont refund a repaired unit, remind them that you've got an un-repair ed (refundable) unit too. Base your premise on what "A pair" means...eg: both the same.

 

 

Update: Jon... I've been speaking to a friend of mine in the states and theres something thats only just become apparent on the MK3's that should definately go a long way towards a refund under the terms of "unfit for purpose" on any CDJ1K MK3 - though possibly other, overiding sales act small print might tie you permenantly to the one that you've accepted back from repair - maybe.

 

I'm not sure that it would be widely accepted if I just posted the MK3 problem publically, but if you're still looking for leverage to get things sorted - PM me and I'll PM you the details back. You're just the right type of DJ for the MK3 issue to affect in fact.

Edited June 29, 2006 by Gary

[milhouse 0]

I was having a chat with a DJ in a bar on Sunday night. He was using his own pair of CDJ-1000's, one was an MK2, the other was an MK3 plugged into the inhouse mixer.

 

I asked how he found the MK3, his expression said it all. He said "they won't play anything mate, they're crap" he also said "get an MK2, the MK3s are s:cense:!"

 

He was having the same problem with the MK3 refusing CDRs, promos, and even some shop bought CDs that were in less than perfect condition, that the MK2 would play without a problem.

[otronics 0]

Any update then on the situation.

 

I still say for the LARGE price you paid, you should get money back or something.

[milhouse 0]

QUOTE (otronics @ Jul 4 2006, 12:32 PM)

Any update then on the situation. I still say for the LARGE price you paid, you should get money back or something.

Awaiting Sapphires to phone me back regarding the unit I've sent back to them. Hopefully that will be today http://www.dj-forum.co.uk/html//emoticons/smile.gif

[milhouse 0]

Sapphires have just phoned me back and say there is no fault found... the unit is on its way back to me yet again.

 

A refund has been point blank refused and yet again they blame the discs I am using.

 

I have been on the phone to Trading Standards today, and they are sending me a load of information in the post about taking this further and what my rights are.

 

I am planning a trip to London in the next 3 weeks to visit a friend, I plan to physically go in to Sapphires and demonstrate the problems I am having.

[Gary 0]

QUOTE (JonWhittaker @ Jul 4 2006, 01:53 PM)

Sapphires have just phoned me back and say there is no fault found... the unit is on its way back to me yet again. A refund has been point blank refused and yet again they blame the discs I am using. I have been on the phone to Trading Standards today, and they are sending me a load of information in the post about taking this further and what my rights are. I am planning a trip to London in the next 3 weeks to visit a friend, I plan to physically go in to Sapphires and demonstrate the problems I am having.

I would say though that if the discs were the problem, then BOTH decks should refuse to play them.

 

Not that I'm hoping that both your decks are going to start refusing discs - I wouldnt wish that on anyone.

 

When you're in Sapphires - try loading the same "problem" (their words, not mine) CD's into other CD-decks around the showroom.

Edited July 4, 2006 by Gary

[otronics 0]

This is simply not on at all.

 

You say these CD's play in ordinary CD players too?

[milhouse 0]

QUOTE (otronics @ Jul 4 2006, 04:48 PM)

This is simply not on at all. You say these CD's play in ordinary CD players too?

Yep!

 

My other MK3, my manky pair of MK1's, my Denon 4000s, my home hifi, all play these cds without issue.

[DJ Marky Marc 0]

Get in the car and get down to there show room...

 

and also invite them to read this thread......

 

Ill come up there with a video camera and video you showing them the fault in there show room and there reaction.. http://www.dj-forum.co.uk/html//emoticons/biggrin.gif

 

[superstardeejay 0]

Did you in fact send them one of your problematic discs as they asked? If so, what was their response..?

 

 

[milhouse 0]

QUOTE (superstardeejay @ Jul 4 2006, 09:38 PM)

Did you in fact send them one of your problematic discs as they asked? If so, what was their response..?

No. Two reasons.

 

1. Legally, its for them to prove there is no fault, rather than for me to prove there is a fault.

 

2. I need all my CDs, every day, all the time.

 

Trading Standards have been very helpful.

 

Im going to carry out their advice and hopefully will get somewhere.

[Gary 0]

So John, whats your next step with the 1 x Working Pioneer player, and the 1 x Not-working-quite-the-same-as-the-other-one-but-no-fault-found-according-to-Pioneer player.

 

 

[milhouse 0]

QUOTE (Gary @ Jul 6 2006, 12:56 PM)

So John, whats your next step with the 1 x Working Pioneer player, and the 1 x Not-working-quite-the-same-as-the-other-one-but-no-fault-found-according-to-Pioneer player.

A very kind Marky Marc is accompanying me to Sapphires later this month, for a live demonstration to them, to "prove" the fault, and expect a refund. I'll show them side by side and I'll say:

 

"Ooh look, the CD works in this one"

"But not in this one"

 

then

 

"lets try the CD in some of your display CD players"

 

I've written to them informing them of this.

 

Don't really want to say publically what my plans are following this just yet.

[Gary 0]

QUOTE (JonWhittaker @ Jul 6 2006, 01:11 PM)

A very kind Marky Marc is accompanying me to Sapphires later this month, for a live demonstration to them, to "prove" the fault, and expect a refund. I'll show them side by side and I'll say: "Ooh look, the CD works in this one" "But not in this one" then "lets try the CD in some of your display CD players" I've written to them informing them of this. Don't really want to say publically what my plans are following this just yet.

Dont pick a wet Wednesday to go up there...

 

Pick a nice really, really, busy Saturday, about 1pm/2pm (we DJ's tend to sleep in and always tend to hit the DJ store on our way to some gig, or other) when there are lots of potential customers in the store, all wondering what the Sapphires customer service experience is like after the first bring-back.

 

You'll be video'ing the event on a cam-corder for web-broadcast I hope... http://www.dj-forum.co.uk/html//emoticons/biggrin.gif (and letting Sapphires and Pioneer know about the cam-corder...)

Edited July 6, 2006 by Gary

[milhouse 0]

QUOTE (Gary @ Jul 6 2006, 01:17 PM)

You'll be video'ing the event on a cam-corder for web-broadcast I hope... http://www.dj-forum.co.uk/html//emoticons/biggrin.gif (and letting Sapphires and Pioneer know about the cam-corder...)

Oh yes, most definately!

 

[otronics 0]

Can't wait http://www.dj-forum.co.uk/html//emoticons/rolleyes.gif

 

Hope you sort out the darn thing.

 

Buy Denon http://www.dj-forum.co.uk/html//emoticons/tongue.gif

[Gary 0]

QUOTE (otronics @ Jul 4 2006, 04:48 PM)

This is simply not on at all. You say these CD's play in ordinary CD players too?

Yes, he did.

 

And...the same discs even play perfectly well in the other Pioneer deck that he bought at the same time, from the same shop.

[RichardP 0]

QUOTE (JonWhittaker @ Jul 6 2006, 12:11 PM)

QUOTE (Gary @ Jul 6 2006, 12:56 PM) So John, whats your next step with the 1 x Working Pioneer player, and the 1 x Not-working-quite-the-same-as-the-other-one-but-no-fault-found-according-to-Pioneer player. A very kind Marky Marc is accompanying me to Sapphires later this month, for a live demonstration to them, to "prove" the fault, and expect a refund. I'll show them side by side and I'll say:   "Ooh look, the CD works in this one" "But not in this one"   then   "lets try the CD in some of your display CD players"   I've written to them informing them of this.   Don't really want to say publically what my plans are following this just yet. Let us know what date & time you're planning to go - I might well come up (a) to be sociable & help put faces to names, and (b) for the spectator sport angle http://www.dj-forum.co.uk/html//emoticons/smile.gif

[djwesty 0]

why not hold the dju meeting there http://www.dj-forum.co.uk/html//emoticons/bash.gif

the thing i've picked up on this thread is to stay clear of the pioneer cdj-1000mk3 and definately dont buy them from saphires

andy

[EdBray 0]

QUOTE (djwesty @ Jul 6 2006, 04:21 PM)

why not hold the dju meeting there http://www.dj-forum.co.uk/html//emoticons/bash.gif the thing i've picked up on this thread is to stay clear of the pioneer cdj-1000mk3 and definately dont buy them from saphires andy

To be fair, I've personally never had a problem with Sapphires, placed a few orders, all been fine. Mind, I have never been required to return something.

 

Eddie

[transeurope 0]

Hmm. I wonder if all this is being sensible.

 

Yes the twaddle about being perfect is to be expected from Pioneer it's what they all say. Even when a CD plays in one side of a machine that has a second drawer and doesn't play in the other. Been there done that a thousand times with all the major.

 

Yes, the twaddle from the Sapphires is to be expected. That's all any of them ever do, with the exception of Thomann, who are variable on the issue of believing manufacturer excuse-lists, but do have a no quibble refund in about the first 30 days.

 

Yes, legally the shop is responsible to sell working goods to you. So by all means pursue it vigorously. Don't take any thrash from them whatsoever.

 

Now, where I draw the line is this public spectacle business.

 

To be honest I have engineered stunts like this myself. Becoming louder and louder as I talk to the assistant, in a "natural way".

 

 

Premeditation is legally iffffffffy.

 

Especially when the shop may say something like it's the first time that they have ever known a case like this....no, really...we were SO surprised.

 

Then this beast tells us that he is going to perform test activities in a retail area with machines put there for display and demo, rather than testing purposes.

 

And he engineers a loss of business on our behalf.

 

And you could be getting into a bit of hot water here, seriously.

 

Especially if you start inviting "gangs of people" as it would be put in a court, over the internet, m'lud...and we all know how terrifying that new technology is m'lud, don't we?

 

The facts of the case require no drama. The machine isn't up to scratch. It's up to Sapphires to present working goods to the public. Your CD player is designed for DJs and doesn't play discs designed especially more for DJs.

 

Next stop the court service.

 

It's doubtful they will take it to the judge. They haven't a leg to stand on.

 

They will just say that on consultation Pioneer were mistaken, and they depended on Pioneer or some similar melodrama.

[Kingy 0]

I don't think going in all guns blazing and filming responces is going to get you anywhere at all.

 

As Transeurope writes, ther are better ways of securing justice. Mob rule does not work and is, in my opinion, un-necessary.