Bose L1

[Andy Westcott 0]

Here, here!

Make the buggers sweat! http://www.dj-forum.co.uk/html//emoticons/biggrin.gif

 

But keep the discusson going, guys! I'm enjoying this.

[Award Entertainment 0]

ROTFLMAO! http://www.dj-forum.co.uk/html//emoticons/biggrin.gif

[norty303 0]

QUOTE

At the time no comment was made about a 900 person audience or reference to the type of music being played

 

No, you're right, at that point the exact details of the gig were unknown.

 

However, the gig in question does require (imo) something more than a mobile system.

 

trying to make do on a gig that is really too big normally only results in dissappointment for all. the provider ends up with (sometimes a lot of) broken kit due to pushing it too hard and the organiser and crowd don't get what they want.

 

 

I know this is a mobile DJ forum but there others here who have involvement in PA and lighting and there are occassional gigs that people get asked to do (such as welshy's) and the questions get asked here.

 

I should think it would be useful for people to have some idea of when they might be overstretching their resources, and also to have some idea of how to evaluate a gig effectively so that they might avoid the pitfalls.

 

 

[Jimbo55 0]

I fully agree with your comments that people need to understand their equipment and it's capabilities.

It would indeed be foolish to enter into any venture without planning to meet the requirements needed. I think that there are several of the members on the forum here are having a quiet (and not so quiet) chuckle at this debate as they no doubt realise that there is much more to planning such a large gig than just deciding which speakers to use.

 

Jimbo

 

 

[Award Entertainment 0]

You are so incredibly right Jimbo55!

 

I have a school ball for 250 teenagers coming up this weekend and I'll be taking my pair of L1 systems. Historically I don't do these by choice, but I've quoted and secured this one because I want to give the Bose a good stretch. I'm not concerned about either headroom or lack of bass, but I'll post my findings after the event. The ballroom is 600m2 with a 4.4m ceiling. Should sound superb!

[Kingy 0]

QUOTE (Rendezvous @ Aug 13 2006, 08:37 PM)

The ballroom is 600m2 with a 4.4m ceiling. Should sound superb!

I think the only words missing here are "In my opinion" Richard. Sound is so personal what I think is brilliant ,you may well hate.

 

Each to their own..... http://www.dj-forum.co.uk/html//emoticons/tongue.gif

[otronics 0]

If you don't like a topic, don't read it!

[NiM 0]

What if you like the original topic, but it creeps in to it?

 

Do you keep reading in the hope that it returns to the topic it previously was, or finish reading there and then?

 

For example, in the big rig thread - I wouldn't have expected to read about the Singing Coatstand in there, but I did.. http://www.dj-forum.co.uk/html//emoticons/smile.gif

[djbzentertainment 0]

I have two old bean tins with holes drilled in the bottom and fishing line knotted through the holes and then attached to my sony walkman tape player output jack. With a nail. Sound is fantastic. Was thinking about upgrading to nescafe tins for more bass but can't afford it at the moment.

 

Jealous now?

 

 

Bob

[Jimbo55 0]

Don't be to hasty to upgrade just yet.

 

The decafe version is being released soon.

 

It has a new stronger string that I can't get the specifications of. When used inline with 'arry my mate (get it... inline array http://www.dj-forum.co.uk/html//emoticons/rolleyes.gif ) the sound spread very quickly and we could use a longer string without shouting.

 

Jimbo

[djbzentertainment 0]

Thanks for that. I may have a bit of useful info for you seen as you run a similar sound system. Got a great mixer the other day. From Kenwood. Model name C.H.E.F. When that lot is pumping out my Daniel O Donnell remixes the power drain is so awesome that my pound shop 12v windscreen jet blue led effect lighting starts to dim. Wow! Oh i didn't mention my amplifier. Its a very new compact one out on the market. Fits in your ear. Look on ebay under "hearing loss" or "the amazing new poppit". Pure quality. I shouldnt be saying this really or all the other guys on here will be getting jealous but all my gear fits into an Asda carrier bag and you can not beleive the admiring glances when i walk into a venue and whip out my carrier bag. Blimey charlie! Woah!

 

 

Bob

[Award Entertainment 0]

QUOTE (Kingy @ Aug 14 2006, 08:44 PM)

I think the only words missing here are "In my opinion" Richard. Sound is so personal what I think is brilliant ,you may well hate.

Virtually everything written on forums like this is by it's very nature, in the author's personal opinion. My opinion is based on 19 years in the entertainment industry, working in bars, clubs, private and corporate events. I also spent 18 months working in Wellington's top Hi-Fi boutique store, selling the best consumer product that was available in the country at that time.

 

I've heard a LOT of PA systems. 99% of them were just too loud. I always err on the side of quality ahead of quantity and it's one of the things that sets me apart from my competition. It's also part of the reason people hire me at a substantial premium, especially over other similarly-experienced operators with bigger, louder systems.

 

The Bose fits the bill for my services perfectly.

[Kingy 0]

QUOTE (Rendezvous @ Aug 14 2006, 09:00 PM)

My opinion is based on 19 years in the entertainment industry, working in bars, clubs, private and corporate events. I also spent 18 months working in Wellington's top Hi-Fi boutique store, selling the best consumer product that was available in the country at that time. I've heard a LOT of PA systems. 99% of them were just too loud. I always err on the side of quality ahead of quantity and it's one of the things that sets me apart from my competition. It's also part of the reason people hire me at a substantial premium, especially over other similarly-experienced operators with bigger, louder systems. The Bose fits the bill for my services perfectly.

No problem Richard. Mine is very similar, nearly 28 years in this industry and 5 as the Manager of a well respected disco, karaoke & PA outlet where we sold (AND REPAIRED) all the major makes of speaker systems, JBL, HK, Db,Bose,Mackie, RCF, Cerwin Vega, Carlsbro, etc alongside all the budget makes. The only ones we didn't stock as they wouldn't give us an account,was Peavey, which frankley, we never missed. (Although they allowed us a spares account so we could repair them!!)

 

Do you not think that sometimes people set up the systems incorrectly or over-drive them resulting in poor sound, yet because it's the sound they percieve to be "great", they accept it as such.

 

An example of my thoughts is that there are lots of folks who accept utilising a pair of Mackie 450s ( or insert any make of 12" speakers) as being the doggies danglies for disco use, which if they are happy with the sound of, fine. Who am I to critisise? They simply wouldn't meet up with my own idea of an acceptable system for the vast majority of my own jobs. Sound is personal and I find the bottom end on 12" speakers not generally as pleasing to me as 15" drivers. Perhaps its my ears. Maybe not.

 

I have only sold somewhere in the region of 5 or 6 sets of speakers each & every week during that 5 year period with very few returns.

[norty303 0]

QUOTE

Sound is personal and I find the bottom end on 12" speakers not generally as pleasing to me as 15" drivers.

 

It never will be and no 12" and tweeter combo is going to ever be a 'full range' cab. By design it is flawed as you're simply asking the 12" to do too much, and in order to achieve the higher notes the driver construction has to be such that will prevent it from doing the low notes.

 

A 12" can do sub duty fine in the right box but thats 'just' sub, and will be in a fairly narrow passband. If you want bass out of a 12" and tweeter/comp driver config, then use a sub to complement, then you're starting to get on for a good system. The 12" will always sound sweeeter than a 15" for mids as its not compromised by its dual function.

[Award Entertainment 0]

I tend to agree Kingy. I would expand on that however and say that most DJs, KJs and bands play a lot louder than is necessary and the trend over the last 5 or 6 years to become increasingly bass-heavy is a worrying trend.

 

My hearing is my most valuable asset as a DJ and I look after it religiously. That's why I'd rather be asked 5 times to turn it up than be told once to turn it down. Being asked to turn it up is a positive sign. Being told to turn it down is almost always a negative sign.

 

The Bose L1 is both loud enough and not too loud at the same time. It's a bizarre phenomenon which several L1 owners in the UK have commented favourably about. I just find it has a sweet sound which I haven’t heard from any other PA system. The brand recognition certainly doesn’t hurt either!

[PEDJ 0]

QUOTE (Rendezvous @ Aug 15 2006, 09:17 AM)

The brand recognition certainly doesn’t hurt either!

Sorry, but I reckon many punters would associate the brand with the back page magazine advert for the radio that nobody pays much attention to or cares for! :)

Anyway punters are not usually product focused whereas entertainers may immediately recognise a brand name like Allen and Heath or Peavey or Yorkville?

Doesn\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\'t the L1 boast sounding the same far away as up close? That could be a nightmare in the summer next year in some venues with the new margin for sound levels. http://www.dj-forum.co.uk/html//emoticons/sad.gif

 

QUOTE

the trend over the last 5 or 6 years to become increasingly bass-heavy is a worrying trend

 

Sorry again, but partial blame for this must surely rest with the modern production techniques in mastering (frequency)? In order to accomodate the lower frequency\\\'s used, the conventional speaker design has got better, indeed lighter with materials available and of course more affordable. I doubt that the L1 was designed purely for DJ use and consequently will not deliver when compared to an active three way speaker system which also can be loud enough and not too loud at the same time without no Hz compromise!

 

You may be surprised Rendezvous that over here in the UK, there are many DJs who would say that they too look after their hearing and have done for over 30 years. Come over and see for yourself! Out of pure common sense let alone DJ experience, I\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\'m sure that many would rather be asked to turn the music up several times on the night than down. Don\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\'t worry, I don\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\'t find you comments offensive or annoying but like you I just wanted to promote an opinion which is after all, only an opinion at the end of the day!

Likewise, another bizarre phenomenon which thousands of owners in the UK have not only commented favourably about (but use weekly) are stereo speaker systems that also appear to sound sweet to both the client and the owner. LOL!

I can see the logic in the \\\\\\\\\\\\\\\"less is more\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\" approach utilising a single speaker (hi-tech) system, but like many of my clients I have two ears and would want to appreciate the full production of music as opposed to a mixed monophonic output.

 

 

 

 

 

 

[norty303 0]

QUOTE

I tend to agree Kingy. I would expand on that however and say that most DJs, KJs and bands play a lot louder than is necessary and the trend over the last 5 or 6 years to become increasingly bass-heavy is a worrying trend.

 

Your ears will generally deal with bass heavy music a lot better than excessively loud high and mid range. Also, for perchieved equal loudness the bass end below 200hz needs to be significantly louder, as shown by the Fletcher Munson work. I would always rather hear a bass heavy rig than one that is too top heavy. Systems of this type (toppy) tend to be tiring after while.

 

As it takes so much more amp power per db to produce bass frequencies, this is why you see massively oversized bass ends compared to mis and tops, simply to achieve the increased spl required for a perceived flat response with nothing 'missing'

[Eskie 0]

QUOTE (Roadie No 1 @ Aug 15 2006, 01:55 PM)

Doesn\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\'t the L1 boast sounding the same far In order to accomodate the lower frequency\\\'s used, the experience, I\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\'m sure that many would rather be down. Don\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\'t worry, I don\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\'t find you I can see the logic in the \\\\\\\\\\\\\\\"less is more\\\\\\\\\\\\\\\" approach utilising a single speaker (hi-

Haven///////t seen so many slashes since the last Freddie kruger movie! http://www.dj-forum.co.uk/html//emoticons/rolleyes.gif

[spinner 0]

QUOTE (Roadie No 1 @ Aug 15 2006, 12:55 PM)

I doubt that the L1 was designed purely for DJ use

You're doubt is correct.

 

The L1 was designed, originally, for individual musician use, the idea being that a solo artiste or each of, say, 4 musicians would have their own L1. It was presented in that setting on the Bose website and on the promotional DVD of which i have a copy.

[brianmole 0]

QUOTE (spinner @ Aug 15 2006, 02:26 PM)

QUOTE (Roadie No 1 @ Aug 15 2006, 12:55 PM) I doubt that the L1 was designed purely for DJ use You're doubt is correct.   The L1 was designed, originally, for individual musician use, the idea being that a solo artiste or each of, say, 4 musicians would have their own L1. It was presented in that setting on the Bose website and on the promotional DVD of which i have a copy. I suspect just like most speakers, originally designed for band use, then came along the DJ!

[norty303 0]

I think that the reason why it was designed for band use was so that you could get back to the old method of sound reinforcement which involved backline also being the FoH system and everyone then also had their own monitor system. It was terrible to get a balance and players had to be very aware of themselves in amongst the overall mix..... kinda why we now have monitors and FoH and monitor techs.

 

The L1 now gives an individual sound source/monitor for each musician but has the benefits of being the same across the board so colourationfrom different types of speaker is minimized. Bass frequencies between the bass modules get some degree of coupling even when not next to each other due to long wavelengths. You also eliminate backwash off the back wall from the monitors meaning less delay effects, particularly for the front rows of the crowd. Hell, I'm almost selling it to myself.... http://www.dj-forum.co.uk/html//emoticons/tongue.gif

 

It's horses for courses really. I'm not sure that the Bose will catch on in the musician world unless its for 2 piece or 3 piece folky type afairs. If you've got a bigger band and everyone needs their own Bose system, the money would actually buy a fairly decent rig and monitor rig for the band.

 

In a folk/jazz setting where musicians may move around and play with others more often than traditional bands the concept only works if everyone owns one. If bands are hiring in a rig for a gig its unlikely a rental firm would stock the Bose due to its lack of versatility elsewhere.

 

I think its success will be measured when they start to come up on ebay. their resale value will give a fairly good indication of how much they've made inraods into the market.