Downloads

[Reverandfunk 0]

Just on the topic of downloads and the legality of them, there are numerous sites which offer a "file sharing" facility and have been operating for a number of years so why have these sites sites not been shut down??

 

Is using these sites any different to borrowing a CD from a friend?

 

Just be interested to know peoples views....

[Gary 0]

Some download sites are totally legal - generally the "high street name" ones, like The Woolworths site, The HMV site etc...and i-Tunes. These are legal, so long as the terms and conditions about what you do with the downloaded music are read and adhered to.

 

Some other download sites, generally speaking, the ones that give you all their files free, are in the most part - illegal. Such sites often stay operational by making use of legal "loopholes" eg: Locating their computer servers on an island which is located outside of US/International Law etc. Such download sites, or Peer-to-peer sites should be avoided by everyone, not just because of the piracy aspects, but because such sites often offer poor quality sound files, and worse, computer virus's, trojans and other malicious code, disguised as sound files. If you've ever been of these scurgy sites, downloaded a "tune(?)", tried to play it and "nothing" :ads: happened...you've probably just allowed some virus or spyware to activate on your PC.

 

 

[robbiedj 0]

File sharing is illegal and people have been prosecuted for doing it.

 

As for borrowing a cd, if you just play it, ok. If you copy it, again it's actually illegal, though, as far as I know, rarely has anybody been prosecuted as a private individual. Using copied discs for a show is illegal, and people have been prosecuted. Apart from a hefty fine, they risk having all audio & video equipment in the venue confiscated. This includes upstairs in a pub, radio/tv/stereo etc.

 

It's not worth it.

[Reverandfunk 0]

As I predominantly use a laptop, how would you differentiate if an mp3 that I'm playing is legal or not bearing in mind I've probably got about 5000 of them?

 

 

[DJ Marky Marc 0]

how would you differentiate if an mp3 that I'm playing is legal or not bearing in mind I've probably got about 5000 of them?

 

 

This is where the licence thing comes into play..(they are still working on it) but you have the option to buy an SG6 licence..

 

to have MP3s on your laptop you would have done one of two things..

 

1) downloaded them from I tunes or simlar and got proof of purchase..

 

2) copyed them from CD or stolen them from the internet....

 

now as copying from the CD is a COPY and there for iligal in the eyes of current law I have put that as option 2 along with internet file sharing..

 

No one here is saying your a bad boy for ripping your now 68 to your hard drive ok.

 

now it works a bit like the TAX man... you have to prove they are not stolen, they dont have to prove you stole them...

 

so latop in a licenced venue with 5000 tracks of unknown origin would mean a big court court case and a lot of work on your part to find all the I tunes emails...

 

A DJ in europe was fined thousands of Euros for playing in a club with music from file sharing sites not so long ago...

 

 

[Reverandfunk 0]

Thanks for the reply, in reality what are the chances of people turning up at say the local rugby club where I work and saying lets have a look at your collection??

[deejaymitch 0]

Thanks for the reply, in reality what are the chances of people turning up at say the local rugby club where I work and saying lets have a look at your collection??

 

Tempting fate?

 

Some download sites are totally legal - generally the "high street name" ones, like The Woolworths site, The HMV site etc...and i-Tunes. These are legal, so long as the terms and conditions about what you do with the downloaded music are read and adhered to.

 

What hacks me off though is that, say you legally download a single from HMV, you get it at a rubbish bit-rate (128 I think). But if you buy the CD from the shop you get 3 or 4 remixes and you can rip it at 320. So again, you're disadvantaged for doing it the legal way.

[Dream Catchers 0]

all audio & video equipment in the venue confiscated

Robbie, I know you are pretty conversant with the music laws due to being involved with LWP.

Can you point us to the information you quote.

Also who enforces it and how?

 

A DJ in europe was fined thousands of Euros for playing in a club with music from file sharing sites not so long ago...

Have you got a link to the story?

 

I know that with pirate software which is a far far greater problem there have been very few prosecutions, also the people that have been prosecuted have been the dealers not the public.

 

Jim

Edited December 12, 2007 by JimBoylan

[Gary 0]

Thanks for the reply, in reality what are the chances of people turning up at say the local rugby club where I work and saying lets have a look at your collection??

 

Its quite possible already, and increasingly likely - especially once the licence gets re(released), hopefully next year.

 

The PRIMARY policing factor will be that the venue in which a DJ with pirated/copied...lets just say "unlicensed" tunes is playing would, under the terms of their existing PPL music license which ALL venues which play music for entertainment must already have, be either fined, and/or (much better, in my mind) have their venue PPL license cancelled - making it then illegal for that venue to play ANY music... and, since a silent venue might as well not bother opening, as well as the venue manager having a great deal of cringy explaining to next weeks Bride & Groom / 21st birthday boy why they cant have a band, disco, or even juke box/ipod playing at their "party" - the owness will be squarely on the venues shoulders to ensure that they don't let DJ Jolly Roger perform at their venue.

 

The quicker the message sinks in the better - I certainly wouldn't expect to see or hear of any DJs with collections consisting of predominately pirated tracks confess to it on-line, especially not on DJU.

 

[Reverandfunk 0]

Thanks for the in depth reply Gary, but as far as policing it goes I personally cant see it happening, I'm not even sure as to what "body" would be responsible for enforcement.

 

I obviously have PLI and in 100 plus gigs how many times has anybody asked to see a copy of it???

[doggyc69 0]

The bugger with this I got a couple of hundred indie cd’singles which I ripped and reduced to 10 cd’s and I can get done for it the whole system is a joke

[Gary 0]

Thanks for the in depth reply Gary, but as far as policing it goes I personally cant see it happening, I'm not even sure as to what "body" would be responsible for enforcement.

 

I obviously have PLI and in 100 plus gigs how many times has anybody asked to see a copy of it???

 

 

It's already happening. PPL have issued venues with public performance licenses for several decades, and have policed those venues for more or less the same length of time. In MOST cases, the PPL Officer merely observes that the venue has merely got the wrong sort of PPL license (they do several types of license to cover various different styles of music use), and in most cases, the PPL officers simply tell the venue that they need to apply for license "X" instead of licenses "Y" and "Z". The PPL officers are not 9 til 5 based so, a DJ with pirated music material of any type shouldn't fool themselves, or others, in thinking that by starting at 7pm, they'll "get away with it".

 

It's been mentioned on-line in the last week that a venue turned away a DJ with a laptop due to licensing (or lack of) - the venues ARE getting wiser...admittedly slower than some would like - but it's understandable that a venue will do whatever it needs to do to protect its ability to play any music in its venue.

[Reverandfunk 0]

You obviously know what you are on about, so what do you see the state of play being this time next year??

[Dream Catchers 0]

It's been mentioned on-line in the last week that a venue turned away a DJ with a laptop due to licensing (or lack of)

 

He wasn't turned away for not having a license, he was sent home because he was using a laptop, there was no mention of him being licensed or not.......

Hi,

 

I'm new to this board, i don't have a mobile disco, i play in bars and clubs who already have an install... however, i wondered if any of you have encountered something which happened to me last night?

 

I was sent home from a venue last night... for playing out with a laptop ! I've never played at this place before, but they are part of a national chain and i've never had an issue at any of their other locations.

 

The manager told me that he could be fined upswards of £50,000 if PRS descovered that I was playing music from a laptop. I am a member of PRS, and have never had any information to support this.

 

Have you experienced any thing similar? I've been using the laptop for 12 months, and have never had an issue with licensing or venues insisting that all music is played from Cd.

 

Cheers

Dave

 

 

Jim

[Gary 0]

You obviously know what you are on about, so what do you see the state of play being this time next year??

 

We will all have to wait and see. There are those members who have just recently joined this forum in the last couple of weeks, or have registered a fair while back and have only just started posting about the whole licensing stirring pot, and those who were involved in the original discussions from ohh, about 18 months back - It would be well worth those recent joiners doing a search on the original posts about licensing etc, but bear in mind that the whole requirement for licencing is currently being reviewed with a hopefully far more practical license being hammered into shape thanks to the License Working Party and "the powers that be".

 

 

He wasn't turned away for not having a license, he was sent home because he was using a laptop, there was no mention of him being licensed or not.......

Jim

 

Unless the venue had some other reason for turning him away, I would imagine that the venue saw the two "misdemeanours" (note to all: Please note the deliberate inverted commas used) as being inter-twined. There are exceptions.

 

Overall conclusion: Lets have this discussion again after the LWP have finished their discussions and the required license is advertised for purchase.

[DJ Marky Marc 0]

I have had 3 PRS/PPL inspections so far this year...

 

each time the man has asked to look through my CDs and spent 2 or 3 hours listening to the music I play and writing a list...

 

1 of these visits was at a hotel.. so its not only clubs that get visited..

 

I have also had several venues ask to see proff of public liability insurance and im at the hilton in basingstoke on JAN 5th and need to make sure i renew my cover before the holidays so that its in place for the wedding I do there as they wont let the DJ play without it..

 

RECORD FINE LINK

 

for those who want to risk a 1.4 million euro fine for playing a download in a night club please be my guest but read this first...

 

"This DJ was touring clubs and making money out of the music he played - while those who had invested time, talent, hard work and money into creating the music in the first place did not get a cent,"

 

and that about sums it up for me...

 

we make money out of this music, so we should pay whats due...

 

P2P music is theft simple as, same as stealing from a shop and the people who do it seem to be kidding them selfs into thinking its ok becuase it dont hurt anyone or some rubbish as its just music and digital..

 

the good thing is however when this licence comes into play there will be fewer cowboys doing this job and more better paid Jobs in bars and clubs ...

 

Edited December 12, 2007 by DJ Marky Marc

[Dream Catchers 0]

RECORD FINE LINK

 

for those who want to risk a 1.4 million euro fine for playing a download in a night club please be my guest but read this first...

I think that there may be a little bit of journalistic license at play.......

 

The fine follows a raid mounted by Italian police earlier this week

It would have been the fastest court case in history for them to do the raid, check what music was legal and illegal and then find him guilty and fine him.

 

I also take reports with a pinch of salt if they do not give facts.

 

Jim

[DJ Marky Marc 0]

would have been the fastest court case in history for them to do the raid

 

you qited out of context..

 

the raid was on a night club ... the DJ case is seperate...

 

it also done help that its a badly writen artical...

 

but the fact stands that they are raiding clubs in europe and dishing out fines to DJs and Teachers for having P2P stolen music..

 

PRS are doing inspections here and venues are becoming aware of the law and stoping DJs from using laptops..

 

bring on the licence I say..

 

 

[Dream Catchers 0]

A "well known" Italian DJ has been ordered to cough up Europe's biggest fine ever for music downloading after being found in possession of and using thousands of illegally copied music files.

 

The DJ must pay a record €1.4m ($1.8m), the Italian financial police have ruled. He also faces criminal prosecution, law enforcement officials said.

 

The fine follows a raid mounted by Italian police earlier this week on a popular nightclub in Rieti, a town between Rome and Assisi. During the investigation, officers seized over 2,000 MP3 files and 500 music videos.

 

There is no other context, it is also the only press release that I can find.

I think it is a scare tactic that they put out. If not why is there no details that can be investigated?

 

Don't get me wrong I think people with pirate CDs, MP3s and software should bear the full weight of the law.

I buy my CDs legit and only do legal downloads and I don't think pirate DJs should be able to get away without paying for their music when I pay for mine.