Flare Horn V Piezo Tweeters

[Llyr Roberts 0]

flare horn v piezo tweeters?

[TonyB 0]

Do you mean compression drivers vs pizza's?

 

Definitely compression drivers

[superstardeejay 0]

Yeah you'll have to clarify what you mean. A horn flare is just the trumpety thing that you see at the front of the speaker cabinet, it's what's behind it that counts. Both piezo (usually cheap) and dynamic (better) can either come as a single assembly with driver and horn attached, or as seperate items, ie flare and driver.

 

Older speakers (with either type of driver) sometimes come with a slatted dispersion grille or a bullet rather than horn flare (or flared horn).

 

But yes, a dynamic driver or compression driver mounted on horn is better than any piezo really, both sonically and for reliability.

 

Your question at the mo is like asking us to choose between a car and a vehicle! :tree:

Edited June 26, 2008 by superstardeejay

[Reverandfunk 0]

More Swaheli.... :shrug:

[Llyr Roberts 0]

sorry, again! I'm learning slowly!

 

http://i6.ebayimg.com/01/i/08/c2/04/6a_1_b.JPG

 

dynamic driver or compression driver

 

v

 

http://i13.ebayimg.com/06/i/08/bd/50/5e_1_b.JPG

 

3 piezo tweeters

 

 

 

So the first is best?

 

 

[TonyB 0]

The first still could be piezo's with a horn attached and the second are piezo bullet tweeters.

 

If they are both piezo's then they will probably have the same characteristic of sounding a bit harsh compared to compression drivers. Not used piezo's for some time so not sure if they have improved the technology as some people seem to think that they don't sound too bad.

[big mac 0]

Hi dude, Many passive speakers now have both so often theress no need to choose, but generally piezo based flared horns have a wider range and handle more power.

This make them a popular coice for active speakers, however they can be easily rattled into failure with rough handling.

Happily they are cheap as chips to replace try ( D-Class on ebay ) and only a couple of screws hold them in and two push clips to replace the back driver which screws on the horn.

My mum can do it !

compresion driver tweets are more robust but tighter range and can lack power unless you spend plenty.

If any one knows a good brand Id be curiou to get a few and try them out.

 

big mac

chubby chaser

[Andy Westcott 0]

Piezo drivers are right at the bottom of the 'economy' list. They are cheap and lightweight, but they are very fragile (electrically) and have a very poor efficiency - typically 95dB/1m/1 watt equivalent voltage.

 

As someone who has used both, I'd never buy a speaker using piezos, or ever build one again incorporating them.

 

Prices?

I can't remember exactly, but I a while back I had a choice of buying a piezo tweeter for about a fiver, or a high quality 'dynamic' (coil & magnet) bullet tweeter for about £70. I went expensive, and still use the tweeters now - testimony to the old addage, "you get what you pay for."

[gadget 0]

I beleive the tweeters are piezo in the speakers I have.... (AI INT-112). They sound harsh at the top end. Hopefully should try to correct some of that with the DSP8024 unit I have (and will try it with the measurement mic too).

 

 

I'd like some Peavey messenger pro speakers (and the subs to match), as soon as possibly can (which have compression drivers in them = much better)..

 

 

David

[UKHero 0]

Dynamic range wise Pizo play the sound you hear when you play a badly recorded tape with lots of his over a PA.. You just get the highest part of that hiss..

 

Comp drivers depending on make and model can come much further down the range and actually produce inteligable sound from them.

 

If you listen to a piz on its own it basically sounds like very high clicks IMHO.

 

Dont use them there junk

 

Nik

[Robster 0]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Loudspeaker#O..._driver_designs

 

 

"Piezoelectric speakers are frequently used as beepers in watches and other electronic devices, and are sometimes used as tweeters in less-expensive speaker systems, such as computer speakers and portable radios. Piezoelectric speakers have several advantages over conventional loudspeakers: they are resistant to overloads which would normally destroy most high frequency drivers, and they can be used without a crossover due to their electrical properties. There are also disadvantages: some amplifiers can oscillate when driving capacitive loads like most piezoelectrics, which results in distortion or damage to the amplifier. Additionally, their frequency response, in most cases, is inferior to that of other technologies. This is why they are generally used in single frequency (beeper) or non-critical applications.

 

Piezoelectric speakers can have extended high frequency output, and this is useful in some specialized circumstances; for instance, sonar applications in which piezoelectric variants are used as both output devices (generating underwater sound) and as input devices (acting as the sensing components of underwater microphones). They have advantages in these applications, not the least of which is simple and solid state construction which resists the effects of seawater better than, say, a ribbon based device would.!

 

 

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tweeter

 

 

"A piezo (or piezo-electric) tweeter contains a piezoelectric crystal coupled to a mechanical diaphragm. An audio signal is applied to the crystal, which responds by flexing in proportion to the voltage applied across the crystal's surfaces, thus converting electrical energy into mechanical (and hence acoustic) energy. While piezoelectric tweeters are relatively cheap, and rugged when compared to typical voice coil tweeters, most are not capable of the same level of linearity and accuracy of reproduction compared to high quality conventional tweeter designs. Piezoelectric tweeters are most commonly found in inexpensive stereo and public address speakers, where cost and reliability are more important than accuracy.

 

Nearly all other tweeters are electrodynamic drivers, using a voice coil suspended within a fixed magnetic field. These designs operate by applying current from an amplifier to a coil. The electrified voice coil produces a varying magnetic field which works against the fixed magnetic field, forcing the voice coil -- and the diaphragm attached to it -- to move. Since the coil is attached to a diaphragm, its motions become those of the diaphragm creating air motions which we hear as high sounds. Modern tweeters are typically different from older tweeters, which were usually small versions of woofers. As tweeter technology has advanced, different design applications have popularized. Today, most tweeters are dome shaped and made of a vibration damping material such as silk, or an extremely light and rigid material such as titanium.

 

Tweeter design is intended to effectively convert an electrical amplifier signal to mechanical air movement with nothing added or subtracted(sometimes referred to as transparency.) The problem is difficult, and real-world tweeter design involves trade-offs. There are many challenges in tweeter design and manufacture such as stopping the dome's motion cleanly at each end of the in/out cycle, properly handling high level signals which require the dome to move farther in and out, and ringing in which stored energy is radiated after the drive signal stops. There are also challenges with keeping the dome centered as it moves, handling large amounts of power in a small voice coil, and with maintaining a stable electrical environment for the amplifier."

 

 

You can stick a horn on any type of tweeter you can not tell from a picture of a horn what is behind it.

[tezandbaz 0]

Do you mean compression drivers vs pizza's?

 

Definitely compression drivers

could`nt resist this one ,sorry tony, is compression drivers a good topping for your pizza`s or do you prefer anchovy........

[supersound dj 0]

In My opinion A s proper speaker should have 3 Transducers to be full range.

 

Low Mid High

 

The mid is usual a 6 inch driver ans the hi must be a compression driver.

 

you don't see many 3 way speakers now days but in the 80s they were around more.

peavey made a range and so did ohm.

 

 

Paul

[TonyB 0]

could`nt resist this one ,sorry tony, is compression drivers a good topping for your pizza`s or do you prefer anchovy........

 

Doesn't matter if I use compression drivers or pizza's, theres always plenty of cheese and I prefer pepperoni topping smile icon

[Llyr Roberts 0]

sorry, again! I'm learning slowly!

 

http://i6.ebayimg.com/01/i/08/c2/04/6a_1_b.JPG

 

dynamic driver or compression driver

 

v

 

http://i13.ebayimg.com/06/i/08/bd/50/5e_1_b.JPG

 

3 piezo tweeters

So the first is best?

 

 

Both of these from class D have the piezo, now i can see why they are so cheap, Ive found only the JAC's have Compression Driver's!

[supersound dj 0]

Look @ the spec of the speakers when comparing them..It usually tells you which transducer they have for hi frequencies ,however they are more keen to elaborate on the fact that it has a compression driver.I it has a piezo then the description is a bit vague.

 

Paul

[superstardeejay 0]

generally piezo based flared horns have a wider range and handle more power.

 

Surely thats the opposite of true? At least for audio applications.

 

Piezo, as others have said, are cheapie tweeters with limited power handling. Larger speakers have to have several in series to limit the voltage to each since they are susceptible to 'wearing out' with high drive voltages.

 

Most quality speakers will use dynamic tweeters either linked to a horn flare or in a bullet.

 

I know the wikipedia says they're resistant to overload but that's more to do with clipping and their inherent high impedance. Overdriven piezos get quieter and quieter and eventually fail open or short. Maybe the author hasn't ever repaired disco speakers?

 

And as Andy said, you can get piezo tweeters driving flared horns so just because you see one don't assume it's got a compression driver behind it!

 

 

 

 

[gadget 0]

 

Also isn't there a major weight difference between the two? piezos are light, and don't feel like there's much there, whereas compression drivers 'feel' like there's something actually in the unit?!

 

Dasvid