The Pro Dub Is Two Weeks Old

[Gary 0]

say for instance you were to tell them the laptop is for the database search facilities only, then...

 

 

 

 

 

...then the PRS inspector just waits 3 minutes until the end of the current playing track and waits for:

 

 

 

a) The silence as you try not to go near the laptop, the PC or the Hard Drive Controller to cue the next track up.

 

 

 

b) You to quickly dash out to the van to drag in the crate/fabric case of dusty CDs

 

 

 

c) You to quickly dash out out to the van to drag in the crate/fabric case of dusty CD-Rs (oops).

 

 

 

 

 

Whilst I've witnessed first hand that PRS inspectors dont just work 9ish to 5ish...I would have thought that it would be extremely unlikely that they'll go anywhere near anyones kit on the night. Its far more likely, I'd have thought that they'll ask your details, if they haven't got them already from the venue, and give you a form to fill out and return within X or xx days about the equipment he/she's seen you using. All of the main Windows based "DJ" programs are pretty obvious, and 100% visually different to Excel or Access or most other mere on-screen databases, so I doubt any fibs about "Its just a database" would stand a chance.

 

 

 

As they say, "Tax inspectors go to weddings too..."

 

 

 

Who's to say that the next lady or gent who wanders up to you inbetween talk-overs/links and asks for a card isnt about to show you theirs, with MCPS-PRS at the top.

 

 

 

I have to say that I think the biggest hurdle that the license has, is that "everyone" has had a "rip" button, or a "record" button, and has been able to use that button with a hard drive or a CD-burner on the other end of it for upwards of a decade now, and quite simply, old habits die hard.

 

 

 

If the said "rip/record" button was just about to be released, and in all the adverts for it, there was a mention of "You'll need to buy this license at the same time", I don't think that we'd be hitting this albeit crumbling wall of relutance now.

 

 

 

The more that the Pro-Dub gets talked about face-to-face, without E-Warriors growling false objections through their mice, the more it seems that people are either already 100% aware or are quickly becoming aware of the requirement for the pro-dub license if they have already, or will be format shifting.

 

 

[djweeble 0]

I don't think that we'd be hitting this albeit crumbling wall of relutance now.

 

 

 

The more that the Pro-Dub gets talked about face-to-face, without E-Warriors growling false objections through their mice, the more it seems that people are either already 100% aware or are quickly becoming aware of the requirement for the pro-dub license if they have already, or will be format shifting.

 

Crap !

 

Crumbling ?? it's getting stronger by the day

 

I'll re-state what I've said on quite a few other forums, I give it a year MAX, and it'll be gone down the same drain as the Digital DJ Licence. Then we'll see all the sheeple that bought it wondering "Why did I waste my money on yet another piece of worthless paper?"

 

 

And as for people becoming 100% aware of it, how many people do you honestly believe know about it and are talking about it ??

 

No more than a couple of hundred, maybe, possibly, at a big big stretch, even as high as a thousand. There's been virtually no advertising, no venue's know anything about it, no-one except DJ's know anything about it.......

 

Go down your local Gym, your local pub, your local keep fit class, local boy scouts, village hall, cafe, restaurant, in fact go anywhere that uses MP3's or any other form of computer music files for that matter, and ask them about it.... I bet you get lots of blank looks !

 

All this and more has been brought up in lots of places all over the net, and it's the same everywhere that people report back from, ONLY DJ'S ON FORUMS know anything about it, and even they know bugger all for certain as MCPS keep moving the goalposts.

 

Perhaps you should take the time to look around some other sites before coming out with comments like that.

Edited July 21, 2008 by djweeble

[LEENEWSOME 0]

Crap !

 

Crumbling ?? it's getting stronger by the day

 

I'll re-state what I've said on quite a few other forums, I give it a year MAX, and it'll be gone down the same drain as the Digital DJ Licence. Then we'll see all the sheeple that bought it wondering "Why did I waste my money on yet another piece of worthless paper?"

And as for people becoming 100% aware of it, how many people do you honestly believe know about it and are talking about it ??

 

No more than a couple of hundred, maybe, possibly, at a big big stretch, even as high as a thousand. There's been virtually no advertising, no venue's know anything about it, no-one except DJ's know anything about it.......

 

Go down your local Gym, your local pub, your local keep fit class, local boy scouts, village hall, cafe, restaurant, in fact go anywhere that uses MP3's or any other form of computer music files for that matter, and ask them about it.... I bet you get lots of blank looks !

 

All this and more has been brought up in lots of places all over the net, and it's the same everywhere that people report back from, ONLY DJ'S ON FORUMS know anything about it, and even they know bugger all for certain as MCPS keep moving the goalposts.

 

Perhaps you should take the time to look around some other sites before coming out with comments like that.

 

BRAVO...BRAVO...BRAVO....llts of hand clapping & whistling.............standing ovation :toot:

 

 

Crap !

 

Crumbling ?? it's getting stronger by the day

 

I'll re-state what I've said on quite a few other forums, I give it a year MAX, and it'll be gone down the same drain as the Digital DJ Licence. Then we'll see all the sheeple that bought it wondering "Why did I waste my money on yet another piece of worthless paper?"

And as for people becoming 100% aware of it, how many people do you honestly believe know about it and are talking about it ??

 

No more than a couple of hundred, maybe, possibly, at a big big stretch, even as high as a thousand. There's been virtually no advertising, no venue's know anything about it, no-one except DJ's know anything about it.......

 

Go down your local Gym, your local pub, your local keep fit class, local boy scouts, village hall, cafe, restaurant, in fact go anywhere that uses MP3's or any other form of computer music files for that matter, and ask them about it.... I bet you get lots of blank looks !

 

All this and more has been brought up in lots of places all over the net, and it's the same everywhere that people report back from, ONLY DJ'S ON FORUMS know anything about it, and even they know bugger all for certain as MCPS keep moving the goalposts.

 

Perhaps you should take the time to look around some other sites before coming out with comments like that.

 

BRAVO.....BRAVO.........WHISTLING & HAND CLAPPING....STANDING OVATION.. :toot:

 

 

Crap !

 

Crumbling ?? it's getting stronger by the day

 

I'll re-state what I've said on quite a few other forums, I give it a year MAX, and it'll be gone down the same drain as the Digital DJ Licence. Then we'll see all the sheeple that bought it wondering "Why did I waste my money on yet another piece of worthless paper?"

And as for people becoming 100% aware of it, how many people do you honestly believe know about it and are talking about it ??

 

No more than a couple of hundred, maybe, possibly, at a big big stretch, even as high as a thousand. There's been virtually no advertising, no venue's know anything about it, no-one except DJ's know anything about it.......

 

Go down your local Gym, your local pub, your local keep fit class, local boy scouts, village hall, cafe, restaurant, in fact go anywhere that uses MP3's or any other form of computer music files for that matter, and ask them about it.... I bet you get lots of blank looks !

 

All this and more has been brought up in lots of places all over the net, and it's the same everywhere that people report back from, ONLY DJ'S ON FORUMS know anything about it, and even they know bugger all for certain as MCPS keep moving the goalposts.

 

Perhaps you should take the time to look around some other sites before coming out with comments like that.

 

BRAVO.....BRAVO.........WHISTLING & HAND CLAPPING....STANDING OVATION.. :toot:

 

[UKHero 0]

Crap !

 

Crumbling ?? it's getting stronger by the day

 

I'll re-state what I've said on quite a few other forums, I give it a year MAX, and it'll be gone down the same drain as the Digital DJ Licence. Then we'll see all the sheeple that bought it wondering "Why did I waste my money on yet another piece of worthless paper?"

And as for people becoming 100% aware of it, how many people do you honestly believe know about it and are talking about it ??

 

No more than a couple of hundred, maybe, possibly, at a big big stretch, even as high as a thousand. There's been virtually no advertising, no venue's know anything about it, no-one except DJ's know anything about it.......

 

Go down your local Gym, your local pub, your local keep fit class, local boy scouts, village hall, cafe, restaurant, in fact go anywhere that uses MP3's or any other form of computer music files for that matter, and ask them about it.... I bet you get lots of blank looks !

 

All this and more has been brought up in lots of places all over the net, and it's the same everywhere that people report back from, ONLY DJ'S ON FORUMS know anything about it, and even they know bugger all for certain as MCPS keep moving the goalposts.

 

Perhaps you should take the time to look around some other sites before coming out with comments like that.

 

 

Same here Bravo Bravo Bravo.... :Thumbup:

 

Its so good to know that other people feel the same way that I do and are willing to make a stand, This is not a go at an individual but this country has been ruined by BL*%DY do gooders who lie down and roll over...

 

Some things are worth making a stand for, Just like the poll tax this is unjust and a money making exercise..

 

DJs are being targeted as the soft easy option and the sheeple (Great phrase BTW) who purchased this on day one are not helping our industry IMHO...

 

You watch the first group to be done for not having this licence will be DJs... Mind you now the MCPS have joined this forum I might have changed that lol... BTW Mr MCPS when you going to post and answer some of the points on this forum? or are you just here to research?

 

Nik

Edited July 22, 2008 by Dukesy

[Dream Catchers 0]

BTW Mr MCPS when you going to post and answer some of the points on this forum? or are you here just to Spy?

I think it is the latter.

As far as hundreds of people knowing about the license I think that as far as the spies are concerned they only will have proof that afew dozen are aware of it. It is the same few dozen DJs that post on all the forums.

 

It does make you think though why the MCPS-PPL have signed up to quite a few forums but don't bother to post to answer queiries or give information.

I expect they have signed up to look at the member only areas to see what "loopholes" we think there are with the license so they can plug them.

 

Jim

[Dukesy 0]

I think it is the latter.

As far as hundreds of people knowing about the license I think that as far as the spies are concerned they only will have proof that afew dozen are aware of it. It is the same few dozen DJs that post on all the forums.

 

It does make you think though why the MCPS-PPL have signed up to quite a few forums but don't bother to post to answer queiries or give information.

I expect they have signed up to look at the member only areas to see what "loopholes" we think there are with the license so they can plug them.

 

Jim

To be fair, they do not really need to sign up to a forum....now, but since they have taken the trouble, we can individually assist and advise on any profession related questions they may now have. smile icon

 

Or....... maybe they have just signed up to cast a vote?

 

The MCPS have indicated they are attending the DJ Show North so maybe they will contact the visitors direct after the show as well as address direct questions on day?

 

Gary, what is the official stance of Denon towards this licence?

[McCardle 1]

without E-Warriors growling false objections through their mice

 

I've just had a childhood flashback!, your quote reminded me of a saying our local C of E school vicar used to use

 

And many false prophets shall rise, and shall deceive many.

 

 

Edited July 21, 2008 by McCardle

[Gary 0]

 

Crap !

 

 

 

When a discussion falls into a reply having to start with vulgarity, it's sometimes indicadive an emotive subject. Fair enough..

 

 

 

how many people do you honestly believe know about it and are talking about it ??

 

 

 

In the last 27 hours – 140 people, DJs face-to-face, discussing the Pro Dub License with professional respect and courtesy, asking questions with professional respect and courtesy, and listening to the answers collectively and, yes maybe you guessed it… with professional respect and courtesy.

 

 

 

Within the next 8 days – over 1200 DJs are anticipated to attend DJ Show North, the first major DJ event since the license became live and a requirement for those wishing to format shift and earn money using the format shifted media. MCPS-PRS will be attending that show to answer face-to-face and, I suspect again with professional respect and courtesy, discuss the licence with any like-minded, and similarly professionals who wish to format shift as part of their business.

 

 

 

Almost immediately after that, including one on Mon 29th in fact, which I’m hoping to attend near me, there are numerous smaller face-to-face discussions taking place at regional NADJ meetings for DJs.

 

 

 

In October, several thousand DJs will be attending another industry show, and again MCPS-PRS have recently signed up for attending.

 

 

 

Given the demograph of those who absolutely require the Pro-Dub license in order to either start, or continue performing with format shifted media, slaaping a 30 second advert in the middle of Coronation Street, isn’t going to actually reach those who need to purchase the license. By attending industry related events and shows, I think that MCPS-PRS are making a very positive contribution to getting succinct information about the license to those who need it.

 

 

 

Also, from Sunday nights large meeting, we heard that PRS inspectors, the people who already tour music playing venues and other businesses, will be proffering information about the new pro-dub licence, expected to be by way of printed literature during their regular visits. Word of the licence is already spreading and will continue to do so amongst businesses.

 

 

 

Speaking of business, and the “other” forums of which you speak, last night it transpired that a very well known owner of another forum, and other DJs, myself included have purchased our pro dub licenses and are already using them as yet another business tool. How? Several of us have already contacted our various regular venues and have made them aware of the license, that we hold it, and that some format shifters may not. Various other DJs at last nights event agreed that the pro dub license was in fact more essential than PLI or PAT, both of which are only optional*, whereas Pro Dub is a requirement for those who perform from format shifted media.

 

 

 

*True, certain venues, such as some council owned venues will insist you have PLI to a certain £level, in order to perform at their venues, and usually PLI has a caveat in it which states that it’s only valid if you have current PAT.

 

 

 

The Pro-Dub licence, for UK professionals is not optional if they perform from format shifted media.

 

 

 

Since some members of this forum are using the Pro Dub license as part of their business methods, Those who are keen to make repeated attacks about license holders, should consider a certain section of the forum Code Of Conduct:

 

 

 

22) Do not publicly start threads or post questioning the business integrity of another colleague or member.

 

 

 

I do not believe that certain aspects of referring to the growing number of Pro Dub license holders by derogatory names falls on the correct side of point 22 of this forums code of conduct.

 

 

 

Refering also to the code of conduct, there are several sections which cover the questioning of another members business ethics or integrity… Why do I mention this? Well, since the 9th of July 2008, user “Pro Dub” became as much a member of this forum and as such, I can find no reason with the DJU code of conduct why that member should be less protected by those rules, than any other member. With that in mind, I saw the words “or are you here just to Spy?” quoted in a post. Surely questioning both the business ethics and the integrity of a fellow DJU member, namely the one who joined our forum on the 9th.

 

 

 

Maintaining and upholding the forum rules and code of conduct has been, in my opinion, an important factor, which has enabled the forum moderation team to shape and nurture this forum to a level, in nearly all subjects, in terms of maturity of discussion which myself and other members feels usually elevates DJU above some other forums. The Pro-dub licence, like, I suppose any “old (free) habits die hard” change, is understandably quite an emotive subject for some and as such I feel that its discussion has not been the most straightforward topic for the moderation teams of various forums to stay on-top of. It’s a tough role, but somebody’s gotta do it.

 

 

[Dukesy 0]

I've changed the original comment to one which is purely a question and not an allegation. The MCPS have a right of reply on any area of this forum and may address any question at any time, should they choose to do so.

 

I will remind members that under the forum rules, please contact a moderator with concerns and not post them on the forum:

 

22) Do not publicly start threads or post questioning the business integrity of another colleague or member. Doing so is totally unprofessional and may appear to the casual observer to be "sour grapes" on your part.

If you have any genuine, provable grounds to question another members business ethics or integrity or if you are a client involved in a dispute with one of our members or have grounds to complain against another member or retailer, then please privately contact a member of the Moderator Team with the details of your complaint and we will try to assist.

 

Any opinions, comments or views expressed on this forum are for discussion purposes only and attach themselves only to that of the author and do not reflect the opinions of Dj's United.

 

 

[UKHero 0]

I think it is the latter.

As far as hundreds of people knowing about the license I think that as far as the spies are concerned they only will have proof that afew dozen are aware of it. It is the same few dozen DJs that post on all the forums.

 

It does make you think though why the MCPS-PPL have signed up to quite a few forums but don't bother to post to answer queiries or give information.

I expect they have signed up to look at the member only areas to see what "loopholes" we think there are with the license so they can plug them.

 

Jim

 

you may have got it in one Jim and to possably to trawl for details etc??...

 

Nik

 

 

 

 

Refering also to the code of conduct, there are several sections which cover the questioning of another members business ethics or integrity… Why do I mention this? Well, since the 9th of July 2008, user “Pro Dub” became as much a member of this forum and as such, I can find no reason with the DJU code of conduct why that member should be less protected by those rules, than any other member. With that in mind, I saw the words “or are you here just to Spy?” quoted in a post. Surely questioning both the business ethics and the integrity of a fellow DJU member, namely the one who joined our forum on the 9th.

 

 

Asking a question yes casting an acusation NO!!! there is a difference!!!

 

Nik

Edited July 22, 2008 by UKHero

[Danno13 0]

I'm suprised so many people are admitting to flouting the law on a public forum.

 

We run a business, businesses have costs.. if you can't handle that then do something else. Why do some people seem to think we can just make our own rules up? And that the world owes us a favour.

 

I hate to come across as holier-than-thou, but it's really no different to cutting corners like PAT and PLI, and paying tax. I don't like coughing up for those every year, but I've made the decision to run a business which has these costs.

 

I really do despair with the attitude of others in this industry sometimes, no wonder DJs aren't taken seriously!

 

[Dukesy 0]

A friend of mine had a phone call the other day from one of his friends for a Wedding in 2009.

My friend plays in a band. His friend (who is getting married) will not require any of my friends iPod music as they will be using their own personal music collection (mp3s) during the Reception when the band are not playing.

 

My friends question was whether the music played on night belongs to the actual client or third party, does the licence cover this type of situation, i.e. the use of personal music not owned by the service provider used in a private environment as well as public?

 

I told him I would present the question here first and phone him once I have some feedback.

 

Thoughts?

 

 

[spinner 0]

A friend of mine had a phone call the other day from one of his friends for a Wedding in 2009.

My friend plays in a band. His friend (who is getting married) will not require any of my friends iPod music as they will be using their own personal music collection (mp3s) during the Reception when the band are not playing.

 

My friends question was whether the music played on night belongs to the actual client or third party, does the licence cover this type of situation, i.e. the use of personal music not owned by the service provider used in a private environment as well as public?

 

I told him I would present the question here first and phone him once I have some feedback.

 

Thoughts?

 

 

Domestic ( ie not for professional use ) ripping to Ipods by the general public is overlooked currently.

 

Whether or not this is because it would be totally impossible to police is debatable, although not the point in this instance.

 

Weddings are classed as private functions so do not require a performance licence although, again, not the point in this case.

 

The licence is for ripping/format changing for professional use ( ie for gain ).

 

Your friend in the band is not doing any so doesn't need a licence.

 

His friend who is getting married is not affected because he is a domestic ripper whose actions are being overlooked.

 

Result: no licence required.

Edited July 22, 2008 by spinner

[djweeble 0]

Speaking of business, and the “other” forums of which you speak, last night it transpired that a very well known owner of another forum, and other DJs, myself included have purchased our pro dub licenses and are already using them as yet another business tool. How? Several of us have already contacted our various regular venues and have made them aware of the license, that we hold it, and that some format shifters may not. Various other DJs at last nights event agreed that the pro dub license was in fact more essential than PLI or PAT, both of which are only optional*, whereas Pro Dub is a requirement for those who perform from format shifted media.

 

The owner of another forum having the licence, has been known about since day -1, when he made it public, but he has also publicly stated that he does not agree with it, he only bought it because his business and forum is high profile.

 

As for people contacting venue's and telling them about DJ's not having the licence, what the hell gives anyone the right to do that ? Are MCPS paying you to do their job for them ? or are you just using snide dirty tricks in an attempt to put people who don't agree with this rip off out of work ? I can honestly say, I would never stoop that low, and I can see that one coming back to haunt a few self righteous people.

 

 

 

Maintaining and upholding the forum rules and code of conduct has been, in my opinion, an important factor,

 

I fully agree.

 

 

 

which has enabled the forum moderation team to shape and nurture this forum to a level, in nearly all subjects, in terms of maturity of discussion which myself and other members feels usually elevates DJU above some other forums.

 

Debateable, DJU is without doubt a good forum, but if you see some of the comments a lot of long term members from here make in quite a few other forums . . .

 

 

 

The Pro-dub licence, like, I suppose any “old (free) habits die hard” change, is understandably quite an emotive subject for some and as such I feel that its discussion has not been the most straightforward topic for the moderation teams of various forums to stay on-top of. It’s a tough role, but somebody’s gotta do it.

 

Care to explain that in plain English, because to us lesser mortals it might seem to read, "You're only allowed to discuss this on other forums because they are inferior", "I'm not going to let you do it here".

[UKHero 0]

I'm suprised so many people are admitting to flouting the law on a public forum.

 

We run a business, businesses have costs.. if you can't handle that then do something else. Why do some people seem to think we can just make our own rules up? And that the world owes us a favour.

 

I hate to come across as holier-than-thou, but it's really no different to cutting corners like PAT and PLI, and paying tax. I don't like coughing up for those every year, but I've made the decision to run a business which has these costs.

 

I really do despair with the attitude of others in this industry sometimes, no wonder DJs aren't taken seriously!

 

Sometimes the Law needs to be as you put it Flouted!

 

Was aparthide right? LAW

 

Was the Poll Tax right? LAW

 

Was the Berlin Wall Right? LAW

 

From your stance Maggie would still be prime minister East Germans would still be loosing there life trying to get to west Germany and Nelson Mandela would still be in prison. Oh and maybe just maybe we would all be speaking or typing in German, unless you were of a perticular colour or religious belief...

 

Maybe over board now with hindsight but at the time who would have believed that all that would have changed.. It was through people standing up agains Laws that made a difference. Just because something is made law does not automaticaly make it right or just.

 

And now for some light reading for you, the following are some crazy laws that still exsist...

 

BREAK your boiled egg at the pointed end and you can be put in the stocks for 24 hours under a law passed in 1561 by King Edward VI.

 

 

WEAR a tall hat at the theatre and you could be fined since someone sat in front of Oliver Cromwell and obstructed his view of the stage.

 

 

DON'T make fun of a boxer during a bout or you're breaking the law and can be thrown out on the street. "Insulting or abusive remarks directed at the contestants" are out.

 

 

BE careful where you scatter a loved-one's ashes as you will be breaking the law if you spread them where they could contaminate the water supply.

 

 

EVER been lost going round a strange round about for the first time? Well if you circle it more than THREE times, you could be arrested as it is an offence.

 

 

NO matter how heated Prime Minister's Question Time gets, Tony Blair and David Cameron are banned from putting on ARMOUR in Parliament since a law passed in 1313.

 

 

STEALING post from the Royal Mail is an offence because it is still classed as an act of treason.

 

 

COUPLES in Birmingham can be fined £25 if they have sex "on the steps of any church after the sun goes down". However, the law says nothing about doing it in broad daylight...

 

 

A BLOODHOUND is the only animal in the world whose evidence is admissible in a court of law.

 

 

IT is illegal to take a cow along a road between the hours of 10am and 7pm - unless you have permission in advance from the Commissioner of Police.

 

 

 

DON'T go to a fancy dress party as a Chelsea Pensioner. Because they are entitled to increased state benefits and subsidised housing, it is an offence to pretend you are one.

 

 

MEN caught short in the street are legally allowed to urinate in public, but ONLY on the rear wheel of their own car on the driver's side of the vehicle.

 

 

SPRING cleaning? Hang a bed out of your window and you can be jailed for up to five years...

 

 

IT is against the law to be drunk in a pub or bar says the Licensing Act passed during the First World War.

 

 

IT is illegal to show affection in public in Wales on Sundays.

 

 

ALL cyclists must ring their bells non-stop while the bike is moving, says a law passed in 1888.

 

 

HUNKS in Birmingham face a fine if they go topless in the city centre.

 

 

RIDING a bike or a horse while drunk is illegal.

 

 

BOYS under 10 are forbidden to look at naked mannequins. This dates from the reign of George V in the 1900s when mannequins first began to appear in shop windows and young boys' eyes started popping out.

 

 

 

ALL Englishmen over the age of 14 must spend two hours a week practising the LONGBOW, supervised by the local clergy. This law dates from the middle ages when there was no standing army so in times of war noblemen were required to provide knights, archers and infantry.

 

 

 

The UK’s top 10 most ridiculous British laws

 

It is illegal to die in the Houses of Parliament

It is an act of treason to place a postage stamp bearing the British king or queen’s image upside-down

It is illegal for a woman to be topless in Liverpool except as a clerk in a tropical fish store

Eating mince pies on Christmas Day is banned

If someone knocks on your door in Scotland and requires the use of your toilet, you are required to let them enter

In the UK a pregnant woman can legally relieve herself anywhere she wants, including in a policeman’s helmet

The head of any dead whale found on the British coast automatically becomes the property of the King, and the tail of the Queen

It is illegal not to tell the tax man anything you do not want him to know, but legal not to tell him information you do not mind him knowing

It is illegal to enter the Houses of Parliament wearing a suit of armour

It is legal to murder a Scotsman within the ancient city walls of York, but only if he is carrying a bow and arrow

 

 

How many have we all flouted so far???? :joe:

 

Nik

Edited July 22, 2008 by UKHero

[andyw 0]

i thought this forum was aboutmaking dj's more professional not encouraging them to break the law/rules.we can't sit back and just obey the laws we agree with.

like it or lump it the license is here you have the option of using just cd's or buying the license

[djweeble 0]

Why do so many people refer to this abomination as a LAW ?

 

IT'S NOT A LAW

 

MCPS do not have the power to make laws.

[Danno13 0]

And now a couple of quid per gig is in the same league as apartheid..

 

I'd laugh it wasn't so depressing.

[UKHero 0]

Why do so many people refer to this abomination as a LAW ?

 

IT'S NOT A LAW

 

MCPS do not have the power to make laws.

 

 

Good point :nbow:

 

Although to be fair copyright is a legal requirement... How ever as you say this licence is not a license passed by our legally elected government so I do see your point.

 

But Andy I still refer you to my above post... Sometimes people have to move against things to get them changed... Our rights and freedoms in this country are being erroded and if it were not for people making a stand we would even less cival rights than we have now...

 

Nik

 

And now a couple of quid per gig is in the same league as apartheid..

 

I'd laugh it wasn't so depressing.

 

Then Laugh and keep laughing it is just the same, we lived with aparthide and if everyone said not my problem we would still be living with it... Nice selective editing BTW

 

Also will you still be laughing when its a fiver a gig a tenner or twenty quid per gig. There is nothing to stop them charging what they want and you will still pay it what ever they say or ask for.... Eventually you will be squeazed out the market as you will be to expensive and an Ipod wedding will be the cheaper option.

 

What about the new DJ we always need new blood in this industry, they wont be paying two quid a gig they might only do 8 gigs in there first year so thats £50 a gig and they might only charge £40 to get a foot on the ladder... Dont suppose you care about them though. These are just the people NADJ and the like should care about because as you I and other DJs retire and die there membership will dwindle and hey all because it started with 2 quid a gig.... Yes over board now I agree but things can and will change do you really think the MCPS will be happy with £250 for time imamorial.... I dont!!!

 

Equipment is getting cheaper and services are getting more expensive this will lead to people buying there own equipment and playing there Ipod... Some people already do, I sold some kit the other week and one guy who purchased some speakers off me said it was for his sons birthday party saved paying a DJ and he could then sell them on when finished with them so virtualy no cost to him... Be warned this is the way it will go... You might go on about experience and reading the crowd. But then we hear of closed playlists, The DJ should not talk its the music that is important etc. We can not have it all ways... I did a wedding last Sunday and played the songs that the B&G had requested it was a great night they wanted a small set up and thats what they got... Was it a good night because of me, my kit or there music?

 

When bugeting for a wedding do they sit down and say this is our list of must play tunes but we need to pay a guy £800 to put them in the right order for us?

 

I dont think they do....

 

Nik

Edited July 22, 2008 by UKHero

[andyw 0]

Good point :nbow:

 

Although to be fair copyright is a legal requirement... How ever as you say this licence is not a license passed by our legally elected government so I do see your point.

 

But Andy I still refer you to my above post... Sometimes people have to move against things to get them changed... Our rights and freedoms in this country are being erroded and if it were not for people making a stand we would even less cival rights than we have now...

 

Nik

 

i was nik,when i first joined this forum it was through my then 15 yr old son,what a find a group of professional dj's willing to give there time/patience and expertise free of charge. there were strict rules in place and they were upheld i was pleased to let him loose on here,now if he found it today i feel it would be a different kettle of fish.reading through the threads today i see people directly calling the ethics of other dj's into question, i see personal attacks and i even see a thread asking what is wrong with illegal downloads,all of this on a forum that is suppose tobe the best moderated and most professional of them all.

no one is more confused about this license than i am, but if it is a requirement then so be it,where do we stop when calling for laws to be broken and who decides.

[Dukesy 0]

 

A friend of mine had a phone call the other day from one of his friends for a Wedding in 2009.

My friend plays in a band. His friend (who is getting married) will not require any of my friends iPod music as they will be using their own personal music collection (mp3s) during the Reception when the band are not playing.

 

My friends question was whether the music played on night belongs to the actual client or third party, does the licence cover this type of situation, i.e. the use of personal music not owned by the service provider used in a private environment as well as public?

 

I told him I would present the question here first and phone him once I have some feedback.

 

Thoughts?

 

Domestic ( ie not for professional use ) ripping to Ipods by the general public is overlooked currently.

 

Whether or not this is because it would be totally impossible to police is debatable, although not the point in this instance.

 

Weddings are classed as private functions so do not require a performance licence although, again, not the point in this case.

 

The licence is for ripping/format changing for professional use ( ie for gain ).

 

Your friend in the band is not doing any so doesn't need a licence.

 

His friend who is getting married is not affected because he is a domestic ripper whose actions are being overlooked.

 

Result: no licence required.

 

Thanks Steve. Same thoughts.

 

I wonder what a venue owner / authorised MCPS inspector could do then if my friend decides to use his friends music during a public gig?

BTW - I've just spoken to him and he said cheers.

 

Now I have another question!

If a band or even a specialist wedding DJ service does not require the licence because the function is private / domestic, why is the services personal ripped music collection not classed the same as a domestic rip?

 

[Danno13 0]

Then Laugh and keep laughing it is just the same, we lived with aparthide and if everyone said not my problem we would still be living with it... Nice selective editing BTW

 

Also will you still be laughing when its a fiver a gig a tenner or twenty quid per gig. There is nothing to stop them charging what they want and you will still pay it what ever they say or ask for.... Eventually you will be squeazed out the market as you will be to expensive and an Ipod wedding will be the cheaper option.

 

What about the new DJ we always need new blood in this industry, they wont be paying two quid a gig they might only do 8 gigs in there first year so thats £50 a gig and they might only charge £40 to get a foot on the ladder... Dont suppose you care about them though. These are just the people NADJ and the like should care about because as you I and other DJs retire and die there membership will dwindle and hey all because it started with 2 quid a gig.... Yes over board now I agree but things can and will change do you really think the MCPS will be happy with £250 for time imamorial.... I dont!!!

 

Equipment is getting cheaper and services are getting more expensive this will lead to people buying there own equipment and playing there Ipod... Some people already do, I sold some kit the other week and one guy who purchased some speakers off me said it was for his sons birthday party saved paying a DJ and he could then sell them on when finished with them so virtualy no cost to him... Be warned this is the way it will go... You might go on about experience and reading the crowd. But then we hear of closed playlists, The DJ should not talk its the music that is important etc. We can not have it all ways... I did a wedding last Sunday and played the songs that the B&G had requested it was a great night they wanted a small set up and thats what they got... Was it a good night because of me, my kit or there music?

 

When bugeting for a wedding do they sit down and say this is our list of must play tunes but we need to pay a guy £800 to put them in the right order for us?

 

I dont think they do....

 

Nik

 

I'll quote the whole thing now to keep you happy.. may as well use up more space on the forum and make it harder to work out what I'm responding to tongue out icon

 

What makes you think MCPS have some kind of hidden agenda here and are some kind of big bad wolf out to rip you off? I just can't work out where you're coming from at all!

 

I guess I'm just more of an optimist that you Nik and I don't think iPods or people DJing at their own events is really much of a threat, besides thats a whole other topic anyway.

 

I wonder if caterers are going to go out of business, people can just cook their own food surely.. can't be that expensive to buy a couple of ovens... or how about any of the hundreds of other wedding/events services that make good livings from their work?

 

Oh, and new DJs can just use CD if they can't work the cost of the license into their pricing. No one is forcing anyone to use digital systems.

 

Also, the continual snipes at NADJ are getting really boring by the way!

Edited July 22, 2008 by Danno13

[UKHero 0]

i was nik,when i first joined this forum it was through my then 15 yr old son,what a find a group of professional dj's willing to give there time/patience and expertise free of charge. there were strict rules in place and they were upheld i was pleased to let him loose on here,now if he found it today i feel it would be a different kettle of fish.reading through the threads today i see people directly calling the ethics of other dj's into question, i see personal attacks and i even see a thread asking what is wrong with illegal downloads,all of this on a forum that is suppose tobe the best moderated and most professional of them all.

no one is more confused about this license than i am, but if it is a requirement then so be it,where do we stop when calling for laws to be broken and who decides.

 

Again Andy I agree with most of what you say above but, sometimes things enrage groups of people enough to act... This is being done on this forum at the moment but I do think it will spread out when other areas realise they are being pressed to have this licence forced upon them...

 

I know that the MU and my union BECTU knew nothing about this licence what so ever. Other than a few DJs on this and a few other forums going on about this rediculus licence no one else has mentioned it...

 

I do think it wrong of some individuals to be informing hotels that they work at about this licence its not there job and IMHO a little underhand and dare I say goody goody... But thats another argument for another day....

 

This lience as it stands it totaly un fair and unjust it targets an easy section of the business comunity ie the DJ profession and has to date left well alone the organised areas such as the MU, corporate and broadcast.

 

I work in radio as well as mobile DJ and other media related work. I know of radio stations that download illegaly music to play on air and have ripped copies of CDs in the studios to play on air. Yet no one in radio land knows of this licence.

 

I work in the corporate arena from time to time and know many sound engineers who use laptops to play in music again "What Licence"...

 

I work with video editors who use music ripped from CD onto there computer editing suit same responce "I need a what to do that"...

 

Our industry is crying out for some regulation and a union of some kind, it is clear the NADJ are not the organisation to speak for DJs as a whole, as some of their members are now promoting this licence and infering that your not a pro DJ with out it.... This says to me what ever the suits decide to thrust upon us the NADJ will back!

 

The LWP was a joke (this is not poked at any individual but the overall effect it had on the licence), a bunch of DJs with the suits... they did not even know what would be in the licence!, with quotes such as "Wait and see" so how they can take any credit (if you can call it that) I dont know....

 

I love this Industry and this forum, but I do feel we are sailing down a poluted river with this one...IMHO.

 

Nik

 

I'll quote the whole thing now to keep you happy.. may as well use up more space on the forum and make it harder to work out what I'm responding to tongue out icon

 

What makes you think MCPS have some kind of hidden agenda here and are some kind of big bad wolf out to rip you off? I just can't work out where you're coming from at all!

 

I guess I'm just more of an optimist that you Nik and I don't think iPods or people DJing at their own events is really much of a threat, besides thats a whole other topic anyway.

 

I wonder if caterers are going to go out of business, people can just cook their own food surely.. can't be that expensive to buy a couple of ovens... or how about any of the hundreds of other wedding/events services that make good livings from their work?

 

Oh, and new DJs can just use CD if they can't work the cost of the license into their pricing. No one is forcing anyone to use digital systems.

 

Also, the continual snipes at NADJ are getting really boring by the way!

 

I think you have lost what I am saying I guess the grass is greener on your side of the fence.. Good luck for the future IMHO you are going to need it...

 

Nik

[Dukesy 0]

I don't read snipes, just opinions. In the balance of fairness, why doesn't the NADJ put a vote to its members and see what the opinion is? Do their opinions count? smile icon

Of course they do!

 

http://www.auburn.edu/academic/liberal_arts/poli_sci/journal_public_deliberation/images/e-voting.jpg

[TonyB 0]

Domestic ( ie not for professional use ) ripping to Ipods by the general public is overlooked currently.

 

Whether or not this is because it would be totally impossible to police is debatable, although not the point in this instance.

 

Weddings are classed as private functions so do not require a performance licence although, again, not the point in this case.

 

The licence is for ripping/format changing for professional use ( ie for gain ).

 

Your friend in the band is not doing any so doesn't need a licence.

 

His friend who is getting married is not affected because he is a domestic ripper whose actions are being overlooked.

 

Result: no licence required.

Thanks Steve. Same thoughts.

 

I wonder what a venue owner / authorised MCPS inspector could do then if my friend decides to use his friends music during a public gig?

BTW - I've just spoken to him and he said cheers.

 

Now I have another question!

If a band or even a specialist wedding DJ service does not require the licence because the function is private / domestic, why is the services personal ripped music collection not classed the same as a domestic rip?

 

Thats a good question. I just had a look at the FAQ on the Pro Dub site and it says:

 

"If you therefore wish to make copies of these recordings for the purpose of carrying out performances such as DJing or conducting fitness classes or any other public performance, then you need to obtain a licence, which in these circumstances is the ProDub Licence."

 

It just mentions public performance. A wedding/party etc is a private function.

 

The license terms and conditions state:

 

"“Service” means the public performance at venues in the United Kingdom by

the Licensee, acting as a performance artist, a disc jockey (“DJ”), a DJ providing

Karaoke, an aerobics, fitness or dance instructor, of Repertoire Works and/or

PPL Sound Recordings."

 

Again mentions "public performance"

 

Definition of a public performance is:

 

"In general, a public performance means anything outside the strictly family or domestic circle. The definition is, however, not as cut and dried as it may seem. A performance in a ‘Members Only’ club is still public although music played at a wedding reception, in a public hall hired for the occasion, is classed as a private performance."

 

So if you only do private functions i.e. weddings and parties, do you still need the licence? :shrug: