Which Compressor?

[safehands 0]

hi all again,ok after my tweeter blowing experience i am going to buy a compressor,although i dont no which behringer model 2 buy as they all do simular things,like have peak limiters on them,could anyone clarify i need this model?? behringer mdx 1600 autocom pro xl????

[superstardeejay 0]

The MDX1600 has features for hard & soft knee compression, de-esser, peak limiter etc..all the things you would want in a vocal mic channel in a recording studio or broadcast suite, but not for a mobile disco.

 

If you're just worried about guarding your speakers against overload, then a limiter would be more the thing, to add progressive gain reduction above a certain signal input threshold.

 

I would opt for something digital or semi-sealed because knobs are easily knocked during setting up and you wouldnt want to have to keep recalibrating a limiter at every gig or risk a false sense of security because you thought it was adjusted correctly when it wasnt! But that's up to you.

 

If you really want Behringer, go for the Ultradrive DCX2496 which has a very effective limiter. Thomann also do an own-branded one which is one of the generic chinese units also sold under the Ohm, DAP Audio, Ecler etc badge and is (like the Behringer) adjustable via laptop and free software.

 

t-racks digital unit

Edited July 16, 2009 by superstardeejay

[safehands 0]

The MDX1600 has features for hard & soft knee compression, de-esser, peak limiter etc..all the things you would want in a vocal mic channel in a recording studio or broadcast suite, but not for a mobile disco.

 

If you're just worried about guarding your speakers against overload, then a limiter would be more the thing, to add progressive gain reduction above a certain signal input threshold.

 

I would opt for something digital or semi-sealed because knobs are easily knocked during setting up and you wouldnt want to have to keep recalibrating a limiter at every gig or risk a false sense of security because you thought it was adjusted correctly when it wasnt! But that's up to you.

 

If you really want Behringer, go for the Ultradrive DCX2496 which has a very effective limiter. Thomann also do an own-branded one which is one of the generic chinese units also sold under the Ohm, DAP Audio, Ecler etc badge and is (like the Behringer) adjustable via laptop and free software.

 

t-racks digital unit

 

cheers superstar,i will look into it

 

[Andy Dunn 0]

Look out for a Formula Sound AVC2.

 

Usually found on e-bay for around the £120-200 mark.

[norty303 0]

Or even better, a Drawmer 2120, but they come up far less regularly

[safehands 0]

Or even better, a Drawmer 2120, but they come up far less regularly

 

hi,where does the compressor go in the chain,is it,,

 

mixer

compressor

crossover

amps

 

??????

[gadget 0]

hi,where does the compressor go in the chain,is it,,

 

mixer

compressor

crossover

amps

 

??????

 

 

If you're on about limiting the signal to the amps then yes it would go between the mixer and crossover.

 

Cheers,

 

David

[safehands 0]

If you're on about limiting the signal to the amps then yes it would go between the mixer and crossover.

 

Cheers,

 

David

 

missed out the eq on previous post so,

 

mixer

eq

compressor

crossover

amps

 

is that the correct way,dave?

[superstardeejay 0]

Looks ok to me if Dave doesn't mind....

 

Please be clear that you want a compressor-limiter or a limiter, not a 'compressor' which will not itself be suitable for protecting sound systems against over-driving.

 

[gadget 0]

Looks ok to me if Dave doesn't mind....

Heh :)

Please be clear that you want a compressor-limiter or a limiter, not a 'compressor' which will not itself be suitable for protecting sound systems against over-driving.

 

Yeah I'd agree that it should go after the EQ unit and before the crossover. Some crossovers have limiters on their outputs too.

 

Or, like superstardeejay has already mentioned before, you could go for an all-in-one speaker management system to cut down the number of 1U boxes you have to link together (as well as mains cables). I currently have an old Behringer DSP8024 which does Digital & Automatic EQ and basic Limiting.

 

 

Cheers,

 

David

[D.X 0]

If you accurately gain stage each piece of equipment you shouldn't need a limiter. It's easy to do this with recorded music as it's already been limited to 0dB so as long as the loudest part of the track doesn't go above 0dB you're safe. I set all my levels before the track comes in using the loudest part and my amp never clips.

 

Also, a Compressor is used to limit the dynamic range of music. Say you had a kick drum and a snare drum and the snare was a bit quieter than the kick. You'd run a Compressor over the top and crank the volume then the Compressor would decrease the volume of the kick leaving the snare untouched. What you need is a limiter although they're very similar.

[gadget 0]

If you accurately gain stage each piece of equipment you shouldn't need a limiter. It's easy to do this with recorded music as it's already been limited to 0dB so as long as the loudest part of the track doesn't go above 0dB you're safe. I set all my levels before the track comes in using the loudest part and my amp never clips.

 

That's ok if your master output when at 100% Gives 0dB, but my master output gives 0dB at about 50%, and can easily go much higher than that (quite a few mixers seem to go beyond 0dB it appears). only takes a knock and you could potentially cause the amp to clip...

 

 

David

[TonyB 0]

Also someone shouting down a mic, dropping one or feedback can easily blow a speaker.

[superstardeejay 0]

If you accurately gain stage each piece of equipment you shouldn't need a limiter.

 

More easily said than done. If this was the case then limiters wouldn't have been invented!

 

As well as in PA's, limiters have to be used (by law) on broadcast radio to prevent 'over modulation' of the carrier, this is to avoid harmonics and illegal transmissions...but they use the same principle nontheless as preventing damage to your tweeters. I remember listening to the Simon Mayo show once (when he was on radio 1!) and it was a phone-in, he was telling 2 young girls they had won a competition and when they heard, they both screamed down the phone. It was loud, and led Mayo to remark that their enthusiastic response had triggered the limiter on his desk and he'd not seen that before!

 

And I'm sure that the Radio 1 engineers had been using correct gain structure!

 

So if he'd been a mobile DJ (!) that could've been his tweeters he said goodbye to.

 

So a limiter is a useful and sometimes essential investment for piece of mind.

 

In clubs and pubs that rent their sound systems under contract (most highstreet bars) the rental companies wouldnt dare put their system in without a limiter...otherwise their profits would soon be eaten up by repairs caused by over-enthusiastic DJs overdriving 'someone elses' equipment!

Edited July 25, 2009 by superstardeejay

[D.X 0]

That's ok if your master output when at 100% Gives 0dB, but my master output gives 0dB at about 50%, and can easily go much higher than that (quite a few mixers seem to go beyond 0dB it appears). only takes a knock and you could potentially cause the amp to clip...

David

 

It doesn't matter where the slider is as long as the signal doesn't go over 0dB. Of course, Knocking it can push it over 0dB.

 

More easily said than done. If this was the case then limiters wouldn't have been invented!

 

Not really, gain staging is pretty simple stuff. I've never blown a speaker yet. I try not to give my Mic to people either and if I do I never take my hands off the controls.

 

Limiters are essential for Live music as you have no control over the dynamics of the sound. With recorded music you have much more control as you know the signal will never go above 0dB so if you set the loudest part near 0dB then you'll be safe. The fact is a lot of DJs don't have a clue about signal matching. My friend has been in the game over 10 years and I still have to tell him off for running my mixer in the red.

 

I guess I need a limiter for when he's playing :wall:

[MintyDave 0]

i usually set my mixer flat out (master and faders) then drop the gains to obtain zero db. Then i dial the master back which being a pot as opppsed to a slider is hard to knock out of place. amp running not flat out but at an estimated maximum for the speakers being used. pre recorded music is then easy to control and i check every song for pfl signal.

 

However i do a lot of karaoke and use a small mackie mixer for mic's. Im sick of people dropping, screaming and "tomatoe sauce bottle" thumping the mics. I havent blown anything yet but am too looking for a solution and have read all the threads for info.

[D.X 0]

Same here Dave. My DNX-500 has a pot for the master gain and is almost impossible to knock.

 

I don't do karaoke fortunately. I deffo would use a limiter if I did.

[gadget 0]

Same here Dave. My DNX-500 has a pot for the master gain and is almost impossible to knock.

 

I don't do karaoke fortunately. I deffo would use a limiter if I did.

 

Is this the small trim pot on the back panel near the master outputs?

[D.X 0]

Is this the small trim pot on the back panel near the master outputs?

 

If you click here it's the top right hand knob that says level underneath.

[gadget 0]

If you click here it's the top right hand knob that says level underneath.

 

Ahh just like a normal master control them. I thought some of the Denon's also had a master output trim on the back near the XLR connectors.... so in theory you could set your master output at 100% for 0dB or therabouts..

 

David

[superstardeejay 0]

The rear master trim on the Denon wont stop you overdriving the amplifiers and speakers though!

 

 

[D.X 0]

Ahh just like a normal master control them. I thought some of the Denon's also had a master output trim on the back near the XLR connectors.... so in theory you could set your master output at 100% for 0dB or therabouts..

 

David

 

No because some tracks are louder than others. One track could be 0dB and another considerably more than that.

[Andy Dunn 0]

Or even better, a Drawmer 2120, but they come up far less regularly

 

 

Indeed,excellent pieces of kit as he says!