The Best Speakers....?

[Slim 0]

Hi there.

 

I have only just joined the forum, but I have been reading posts over the last few weeks and picked up a lot of info already from many of the regular posters.

 

I used to share equipment with someone as we didn't do many gigs. Now we live too far apart, we are going to sell that lot and I want to buy a new disco (within a fairly tight budget I'm afraid).

I don't need BIG...most gigs I would do would be for less than 150 people.

 

So far I have bought from ebay.... twin Denon DND4500 CD's, a Citronic CDM 10:4 Mk2 mixer and a Carlsboro Powerline 500 Amp. The amp gives 2 x 125w in to 8Ohm and 2 x 250w in to 4 Ohm. I learned about that from this forum!

 

The most important thing to me is the quality of the sound, so I'm trying to get the best sound I can from the equipment I already have.

 

So, what are the best speakers, or the best combination of speakers I can add to that to give the best sound? I have a budget of £300 (ish) and I'm happy to go 2nd hand.

I have seen 2 JBL 15" speakers for £200, but they are 8Ohm and I have noticed that there are some Peavey Hisys 2 that are 4 Ohm around which would presumably give me more power...

Any other suggestions?

Thanks!

[superstardeejay 0]

That amp is probably the weak link TBH. They are woefully poor and lack guts. They are easy to clip which means short-lived voicecoils in your speakers.

 

The Peavey Hisys-2 / 4ohm you mention is a particularly worthy speaker and likes being driven hard with disco music, they aren't so hot for karaoke due to the high vocal content and can blow their tweeters if a punter screams or generates howling feedback and you aren't watching the levels.

 

JBL do some great speakers but unfortunately issued some budget ranges a few years back which failed to live up to their name..so be careful.

 

Your tiny Carlsbro amp will run out of power well before the HiSys or other pro speakers are pumping nicely.

 

For a pair of Hisys2 4ohm speakers, look for an amp of 450W or more (rated at 4 ohms per channel RMS).

 

As experience will show you, cheap amps tend to 'big-up' their wattage to sell them, rather than being totally honest. I'm afraid I consider your powerline 500 to be in this category.

 

Weeding out the sheep & goats is an aquired skill.

 

If you're on a tight budget, the Behringer EP series amps are fine, or a second-hand upmarket one might be ok..but check back here for informed advice if you've seen something used that takes your fancy.

 

[Slim 0]

Great start to my question. I was wondering about the amp.

In the kit that we will be selling there is a JBsystems AX700. Ever heard of them, or are they a bit budget too?

On the speaker front, there is a local supplier selling 2nd hand Peavey Messenger Pro 15" and Messenger Pro bass bins. They would be within budget (or just a bit outside it)...any good?

[centrestagediscos 0]

Hi there.

 

I have only just joined the forum, but I have been reading posts over the last few weeks and picked up a lot of info already from many of the regular posters.

 

I used to share equipment with someone as we didn't do many gigs. Now we live too far apart, we are going to sell that lot and I want to buy a new disco (within a fairly tight budget I'm afraid).

I don't need BIG...most gigs I would do would be for less than 150 people.

 

So far I have bought from ebay.... twin Denon DND4500 CD's, a Citronic CDM 10:4 Mk2 mixer and a Carlsboro Powerline 500 Amp. The amp gives 2 x 125w in to 8Ohm and 2 x 250w in to 4 Ohm. I learned about that from this forum!

 

The most important thing to me is the quality of the sound, so I'm trying to get the best sound I can from the equipment I already have.

 

So, what are the best speakers, or the best combination of speakers I can add to that to give the best sound? I have a budget of £300 (ish) and I'm happy to go 2nd hand.

I have seen 2 JBL 15" speakers for £200, but they are 8Ohm and I have noticed that there are some Peavey Hisys 2 that are 4 Ohm around which would presumably give me more power...

Any other suggestions?

Thanks!

 

i would have a look on thomann at their own speaker range the box if you could stretch your budget just a little bit further or if you get lucky they may have some b stock you can pick up powered speakers 400 watts rms and although many on here would label them as budget speakers they do out perform there price tag if you do a search on here old members who have had them are very complimentary about them and they also give you a 3 year warranty even on the b stock

[Slim 0]

Oh, and the JBL speakers are JRX115's...are they the decent ones or the duff ones?

[vokf 0]

This won't help (much), but I've picked up a pair of dB Cromo 12s for just over £500.

Nice sound, 300WRMS (apparently...), giged them twice and tomorrow for a Wedding, but were purchased as backup.

I ran a few head-to-head comparisons with the W-Audio budget actives, and a few others, these sounded better.

 

I can't comment on reliability (Superstardeejay?), but possibly an option if you sell the Amp? As these are actives, you'll run straight out of your mixer into each.

 

Embarrassingly, I prefer the sound to the mackies (when up close). I need to run a head-to-head test, but they do sound warmer.

 

[DJMickeyk 0]

I have a pair of JBL Eon 15-P1 (active) that are in absolutely mint condition, as new and they wouldn't be far out of your price range. Not sure what carraige would cost as I'm over on the emerald isle but if you are interested they are a nice speaker. They are 180 Watt (I think) each with 15" drivers and 1" horn, don't be fooled by the 180 watts, they are a match for speakers with much higher power rating.

 

I have them for sale in Ireland linky

 

The rest of the stuff in the ad sold almost immediately but I still have the speakers. Genuinely used less than 20 times, I got them brand new in a clearance sale, I normally use their newer model the G2. They would be good for what you want to do, 100-150 people but do sound better when used with a sub (as is the case with any speaker really). Drop me a pm if interested, but carraige may be prohibitive

Edited March 5, 2011 by DJMickeyk

[sparklingdiscos 0]

£300 should get you a good pair of active speakers, certainly a better option than having some £300 passives with a weakish amp, as the inbuilt amps and speakers are perfectly matched.

 

Some quite good options out there - W-audio PSR15As are a good option and seem to have settled at £300 a pair second hand.

 

Or if you reach to £500 youre into second hand MAckie SRM450s and everything at that level.

[Slim 0]

Thanks for the info everyone. Plenty for me to think about.

 

I have had a look at the JBL's you have for sale DJMick, and they do look really nice.

How much would they be? If I can get powered speakers, I can sell my amp and use that towards the cost. I'll have a look at shipping costs from Ireland.

 

Thanks again everyone for all your advice.

[DJMickeyk 0]

Thanks for the info everyone. Plenty for me to think about.

 

I have had a look at the JBL's you have for sale DJMick, and they do look really nice.

How much would they be? If I can get powered speakers, I can sell my amp and use that towards the cost. I'll have a look at shipping costs from Ireland.

Hey slim, sorry mate sold them this morning, typical! Think you should have no problem picking up a good pair in the UK anyhow, if you spot something on ebay ask about it here before you buy, you'll get great advice, there is somebody coming to collect mine next week apologies again. Best of luck finding something suitable.

 

Mike

[MintyDave 0]

Hi Slim

 

i can vouch for the peavey hisys 2's (8ohm versions) as thats what i used. Fairly bombproof...shame my back isn't.

 

I have all my old peavey rig on ebay (ends tomorrow night) but i dont think you need all of it and im 4.5 hrs away. round the 25 up the M1 etc etc (relatives round the corner from you)

 

the wharfedale evp's sound ok and are 339 a pair but you would need a bigger amp, ideally something that pumps out 500w per side at 8ohms.

 

IMO a good sound rig is the most important thing next to playing the right music of course so i would concentrate on that.

 

good luck

 

 

[superstardeejay 0]

The best sound systems are those that are not pushed to the limit in order to get enough volume for your needs. A sound system that is pushed will sound poor. It needs an easy time if you're to keep it working reliably and sweetly.

 

Some people think that if they've spend money on a 500W amp, they must run it flat out to get their money's worth. This is false economy, it will eventually fail.

 

If you need to run a 500W amp flat out to get satisfactory levels, buy a 1000W one and then run it at half power.

 

Or run your 500W amp at half power and try and live with it.

 

Power levels on amps are like Speed Limits on roads. 30mph is the absolute maximum you should drive, not the mandatory speed you must drive at.

 

In the olden days of british and american amps, the manufacturers would build a 700W amp and call it 500W just to be safe.

 

Now in the days of chinese everything, a 500W amp is often a 300W amp with a 500W badge on it.

 

JB Systems are a budget chinese amp like the Carlsbro Powerline.

 

I've never repaired any W-Audio (Warrior) powered speakers but they will be like any other chinese powered speaker.

I prefer the cabinets of chinese powered speakers to the actual amp modules. Cabinet designs are easy to copy from western designs and get right cheaper, its more difficult to copy a good amp module from the west and build it with the same reliability.

Edited March 6, 2011 by superstardeejay

[Slim 0]

OK, so..... I have 2 options on ebay at the moment.

 

1, JBL JRX115's or Peavey HiSys2XT with black widows.

2, sell the carlsboro amp and buy either a Behringer EP1500 or a Yamaha P4500.

 

The JBL's and the Yamaha are a bit more money, but which would you recommend from that lot. All of it comes in at under £350.

 

Minty, I will concentrate on playing the right music...I seem to get a fairly good reaction from a mix of 70's Anthems in to 80's disco and party music. Latest addition is Elbow Bones and the Racketeers, A night in New York. Fab!!!! :Thumbup:

 

Anyway, welcome your views chaps before I start on about lights!

[Slim 0]

OK, not sure if anyone is still reading this....

I bought the Hisys 2's. Now we need to change the amp.

 

The speakers are 8 ohm.... I know I can add another 8 ohm pair, but can I ad a 4ohm pair if I get a decent amp?

 

Thanks...

[MintyDave 0]

OK, not sure if anyone is still reading this....

I bought the Hisys 2's. Now we need to change the amp.

 

The speakers are 8 ohm.... I know I can add another 8 ohm pair, but can I ad a 4ohm pair if I get a decent amp?

 

Thanks...

 

Hi slim, still reading!

 

You can add another pair of 8 ohm cabs to the hisys's which will give you a total load of 4ohms per side. any less may damage your amp unless its built to take a lower load (2ohm) If you add a set of 4 ohm cabs then you get 2.6667 ohms

 

you can however add some bass bins like the peavey hisys 115xt which are 4 ohm and use the hi output on the bins to link the tops. the crossovers in the peaveys bins allow even 4 ohm tops to be connected without lowering the overall imedance.

 

if you do the above, using 4 ohm bins and 8 ohm tops from 1 amp is better IMO as with 4 ohm tops you get too much mid highs. 8ohm = greater resistance basically

 

Amp wise i would look at something quite big. If you end up with 2 sets of tops (1400w total) then you want a 2000w power amp as many would say its best to have an amp twice the power of your speakers - the idea is like having a 50mph speed limit and buying a car that only does 50mph - it will soon blow up

 

also amp spec is far from accurate and a 2000w amp may only deliver 1800w

 

hope this helps

[Slim 0]

Thanks Minty... that's a big help.

So with the HiSys 2's I need to look for an amp that will give more 500w in to 8 Ohms?

 

I have just a couple of other questions if anyone owns or has owned hisys 2's.... I can not find any info on the weight of the speakers, so unsure of what stands i need for them.

Also, there is a switch on the back of one of the speakers that seems to be an EQ switch...any idea what that does?

 

Thanks again

 

[orbitdisco 0]

I think HiSys2s weigh about 28kg from memory, the stand holes in the bottom are 35mm diameter.

 

I used to run mine (which were the 4 ohm version) from a Peavey PV1500 amp which gave 500W RMS into 4 ohms and drove them nicely. If yours are the 8 ohm ones then the PV2600 may be a better choice. The switch on the back alters the 'voicing' I didn't have that on mine as they were the original 'mk1' version but I think it just cuts the HF (treble) down a tad.

[Slim 0]

Thankyou, i have seen a tripod that takes up to 30kg so that should be ok.

I'll have a look at the PV amp. Thanks for the advice!

 

By the time I'm done, this should sound pretty good!...then - lights!

Edited March 15, 2011 by Slim

[MintyDave 0]

Thanks Minty... that's a big help.

So with the HiSys 2's I need to look for an amp that will give more 500w in to 8 Ohms?

 

I have just a couple of other questions if anyone owns or has owned hisys 2's.... I can not find any info on the weight of the speakers, so unsure of what stands i need for them.

Also, there is a switch on the back of one of the speakers that seems to be an EQ switch...any idea what that does?

 

Thanks again

 

now thats a bit confusing, they obviously are not an original "pair" if one has a voicing switch and the other doesn't

 

i think the hisys 2 xt's had that switch but i may be wrong. Just to be sure, they both have parallel speakon sockets and are definately 8 ohm?

 

re amping, the rms should be 350rms with 500w peak so i would look for an amp that is about 1500w@ 4 ohm which will give you rougly 500w per side at 8ohms. Like i said you may want to go a bit bigger just in case you add another set of cabs or bass bins or just want more headroom

 

stick them on a set of bathroom scales to weigh them. i think they are 32kg ish. definatey heavier than a sack of spuds which is 25kg/55lb/4st

[double d 0]

Hi Slim,

 

Peavey pro15's are great, though you must check which ones, 8ohm or 4ohm tops, the subs are all the same(4ohm) but the tops are differant.

i have the 4ohm tops and bottoms and they are awesome speakers, im running a 500watt rms (per channel) amp but only at 1/2 way and they really pump

 

i know you say you only do gigs for up to 150, but they will do a gig for 300-400 without too much trouble. and its that time where you get offered a wedding and your system isnt up to it.........

 

i have a garden gig for some friends this summer and i have 100% confidence in my peaveys.

 

hope this helps

 

 

 

 

[double d 0]

forgot to add,

 

maplins, :damn: have a promotion on their 1600 watt amp which will give you 500watt rms per channel @ 4ohm

 

its been reduced to £175, get in quick

[Slim 0]

Thanks everyone for your help.

It does seem odd that only one speaker has an eq switch. I'd better check that they are both as they were described and actually have the black widows in them.

 

Anyone know how to tell if they are black widows?

 

I bought a Peavey PV1200 amp. Immaculate condition and I believe gives 2 x 270w in to 8 Ohms. It will go down to 2 Ohms, so I have plenty of room to add more if I feel I need it.

I know it's not a new amp, but it seems to get good reviews.

 

Right then, lights....I have seen some NJD projectors..some ar 100w and some are 250w. Will 250w be too bright for smaller venues.?

 

 

[MintyDave 0]

Thanks everyone for your help.

It does seem odd that only one speaker has an eq switch. I'd better check that they are both as they were described and actually have the black widows in them.

 

Anyone know how to tell if they are black widows?

 

No problem at all slim, glad we can be of use considering all the senseless waffle we sometime spill out

 

RE the speakers - it will say black widow somewhere on the actual speaker, cant remember if its a label on the magnet or basket. you may need to CAREFULLY drop the driver out to see as the view through the handle hole is not brilliant. if they are not BW i would get onto the seller as they could have fitted any old rubbish

 

Right then, lights....I have seen some NJD projectors..some ar 100w and some are 250w. Will 250w be too bright for smaller venues.?

 

i would avoid 100w fixtures as they are a bit underpowered now, i do some very small venues and 250w fixtures are fine but you may want to look at an led fixture like the acme miracled for this type of gig to keep the heat down to a minimum

 

the njd datamoons are probably one of the best 250w gobo flowers on the market at the moment. they come with a very useful controller. £235 for 2 fixtures, controller dmx lead and flightcase - bargain.

Edited March 21, 2011 by MintyDave

[Slim 0]

Hi again...

 

Right, I've just taken out the drivers on my speakers and there is no mention of BW or any Peavey identification...looks like I'll be going back to the seller. Not sure what I can do about it, but they were specifically advertised as BW equipped.

When the amp arrives, I'll see how they sound before I decide what to do.

 

I picked up a booking at a hotel for a school PTA summer Ball. Went to see the venue today and it's quite a size. 150 people sitting down to dinner and a dance floor, so the 250w lights will be needed.

 

Last question....I weighed the speakers as advised using the bathroom scales! 30.9 kg, so 1 kilo over the max advised for the tripods I've seen...is that too risky?

 

I lied, this is the last question. Public liability insurance, can you get it before you register as a business?

 

Thanks!

[Raymilkybarkid 0]

Public liability insurance, can you get it before you register as a business?

 

 

 

Yes I use DJ PLI Website good honest value for money IMO.

Edited March 22, 2011 by Raymilkybarkid