YourBigEvent 0 Posted November 19, 2005 Report Share Posted November 19, 2005 Do you have Employers Liability Insurance I have just had to take out insurances for the whole business, including the above. Do you have the insurance for your 'employees' ? .....but what do I know ? Your Big Event Office:01803 813540 Direct: 0797 0717 448 e.mail:info@yourbigevent.co.uk Link to post Share on other sites
Andy Westcott 0 Posted November 19, 2005 Report Share Posted November 19, 2005 No, but I will have to consider it if/when me or my son restart. Up until now, I have always been able to rely on one of three particular friends to assist, and have slipped them a little something for their help. Not the most professional way of doing things, but it worked for many years. I'd like to think if there was an accident, there would be no claim by them, but if it came to the crunch, people are known to be very greedy, often putting money above friendship and trust, so I feel I can no longer take the risk. As for the law, if a friend assists as a favour, then he isn't technically an employee, is he? Even if given a 'gift' at the end for his help? I don't know, and I need to. http://www.dj-forum.co.uk/html//emoticons/sad.gif Link to post Share on other sites
chrismk 0 Posted November 19, 2005 Report Share Posted November 19, 2005 QUOTE (Andy Westcott @ Nov 19 2005, 12:41 PM) I'd like to think if there was an accident, there would be no claim by them, but if it came to the crunch, people are known to be very greedy, often putting money above friendship and trust, so I feel I can no longer take the risk. There is still a grey area in the employment law, I was under the impression it was five or more employees you had to have insurance, also remember that the greedy insurance culture is slowly being stopped in its tracks by people who have abused the system, if a person is injured its not just simply a matter of seeing a lawyer anymore and going to court, this though does depend as Im well sure of many factors such as accidental injury, self inflicted accidental injury and so on, then to cap it all off was it possible to prevent such accident by both employee and employer, is the employee trained for the job, its so deep you could go on for weeks and weeks on the subject of blame alone. Cheers Link to post Share on other sites
DiscoStudio 0 Posted November 19, 2005 Report Share Posted November 19, 2005 (edited) The law on employers' liability insurance is not really that grey. I studied it in detail when I took on my first employee. You only have to have employers liability insurance if you actually employ someone, on a PAYE basis. If you employ someone, you pay their TAX and National Insurance to the government for them and take it out of their wages before you pay them. This is the PAYE scheme. A rodie is paid as a self-emplyed person and anything you pay them, they are supposed to declare it in a self-assessment tax return that they should do every year, they are not employed and therefore employers' liability insurance laws don't apply. Edited November 19, 2005 by DiscoStudio <a href="http://www.djassociates.org"><img src="http://www.djassociates.org/anims/compres_banner.gif" alt="Join the DJ Associates Disc Jockey Association" border="0" width="468" height="60"></a> Link to post Share on other sites
YourBigEvent 0 Posted November 19, 2005 Author Report Share Posted November 19, 2005 Not how I read it, I thought if you 'employed' someone, even your own son or daughter, thye could mke a claim against you and so you need it. .....but what do I know ? Your Big Event Office:01803 813540 Direct: 0797 0717 448 e.mail:info@yourbigevent.co.uk Link to post Share on other sites
DiscoStudio 0 Posted November 19, 2005 Report Share Posted November 19, 2005 (edited) That's correct if you employ someone on PAYE. If not they are self-emplyed, they are not classed as an employee and therefore that law doesn't apply. Edited November 19, 2005 by DiscoStudio <a href="http://www.djassociates.org"><img src="http://www.djassociates.org/anims/compres_banner.gif" alt="Join the DJ Associates Disc Jockey Association" border="0" width="468" height="60"></a> Link to post Share on other sites
milhouse 0 Posted November 19, 2005 Report Share Posted November 19, 2005 Correct Its like when any of us do work for an agency. The agency does not have to take out any insurance/licenses etc as they dont "employ" us, we are self employed and they are in essence a client of ours. Link to post Share on other sites
jeffwall 0 Posted November 19, 2005 Report Share Posted November 19, 2005 The kitchen companies who use sparks / joiners etc are getting away with by getting the customer to pay the labourer direct.... For example, if you do a gig for 200 quid for a venue/hotel/private you can say to them its "160 for the dj and 40" for the roadie therefore puts the liability on the roadie for income tax etc.....Just get them to write 2 cheques or pay two amounts cash (if there using cash) Youve then just took money for your part of the gig, the roadie has took his! One way of sorting from a dj's point of view? But therefore the roadie will have to declare self employment and hand in an invoice probably If you use a person who has a full time job and is helping you "on the side" He can be self employed as well as paye as far as tax is concerned. So can do this no prob if he is willing to register self employed Link to post Share on other sites
DiscoStudio 0 Posted November 19, 2005 Report Share Posted November 19, 2005 Well you can do it that way or just give your roadie £40 and make him invoice you, then you just put it down as an expense. He doesn't even have to give you an nvoice, you just need something with their name and address on it saying that you have given them £40 and they have to sign and date it. I have a standard form I used to use when I brought a joey with me. I will dig it our and upload a PDF to this thread. ...Or I would do but there don't seem to be an attachment option. <a href="http://www.djassociates.org"><img src="http://www.djassociates.org/anims/compres_banner.gif" alt="Join the DJ Associates Disc Jockey Association" border="0" width="468" height="60"></a> Link to post Share on other sites
chrismk 0 Posted November 20, 2005 Report Share Posted November 20, 2005 QUOTE (JonWhittaker @ Nov 19 2005, 04:41 PM) Correct Its like when any of us do work for an agency. The agency does not have to take out any insurance/licenses etc as they dont "employ" us, we are self employed and they are in essence a client of ours. Employment law now covers agencies too but if you are self employed and do contract work it falls out of this, ie: Builders, DJing etc, as long as it doesnt continue for more than 6 months straight then there is no problems, this came in because bad employers were getting away without paying holiday pay to construction workers and so on in other industries, also doing agency work only if not and advantage, I want nothing to do with them in this field Link to post Share on other sites
jeffwall 0 Posted November 20, 2005 Report Share Posted November 20, 2005 QUOTE (DiscoStudio @ Nov 19 2005, 05:26 PM) Well you can do it that way or just give your roadie £40 and make him invoice you yeah that would be the easy way, but like mentioned in chrismk post the inland rev are asking not to use the same people over and over unless you take them on your books as paye, so could cause probs for some? Thats why companies like kitchen/conserv companies are using self employed "sub contractors" and asking the customer to pay them direct instead of recieving the money then giving it out to the contractors....save them any liability (think it may save them on bad workmanship issues too, "take it up with the fitter not us" kind of arguement) Thats better for me personally as i dont have to wait the old 2 months payment time etc which they love doing! Link to post Share on other sites
DiscoStudio 0 Posted November 20, 2005 Report Share Posted November 20, 2005 Yeh, but if they invoice you, they will never be classed in that way and therefore even those rules will not apply. <a href="http://www.djassociates.org"><img src="http://www.djassociates.org/anims/compres_banner.gif" alt="Join the DJ Associates Disc Jockey Association" border="0" width="468" height="60"></a> Link to post Share on other sites
jeffwall 0 Posted November 20, 2005 Report Share Posted November 20, 2005 ahhhh but if the same person invoices you many times in the year, the inland rev will deem that as "you are using this person all the time so take him on the books" not sure if it applies to the DJ game.... its beginning to filter through in the contracting trades tho...But only if the sub contractor is employed constantly by the main company i believe....must admit not my strongest point is employment law! But i believe changes in this respect are due in april? Link to post Share on other sites
DiscoStudio 0 Posted November 20, 2005 Report Share Posted November 20, 2005 In theory yes, but no because it is a sel-employed basis. That's like saying if you hire a development company to build you a house and it takes more that six months, you have to take them onto your payroll and get emplyers' liability. Or if you work for a hotel, 2 nights per week for six months they don't have to emply you. If you are self-emplyed that is exaclty what you are. <a href="http://www.djassociates.org"><img src="http://www.djassociates.org/anims/compres_banner.gif" alt="Join the DJ Associates Disc Jockey Association" border="0" width="468" height="60"></a> Link to post Share on other sites
jeffwall 0 Posted November 20, 2005 Report Share Posted November 20, 2005 http://www.hm-treasury.gov.uk/media/8EB/69...mpanies_228.pdf Really usefull document this which applies to most of us in one way or another Once you get through the government boring stuff, the examples shown for peoples diffrent situations are quite good It descibes the diffrences and liabilitys of sole traders....limited companys ...and partnerships etc http://www.lawspeed.com/others/services_fo..._companies.aspx Just found this too which is what i was on about, seems its the construction industry is what the inland revenue are trying to sort out....basically they are saying that as from april 2007, if your a construction company and use self employed people on the CIS scheme, you will no longer be able to take them on as "self employed" you will have to take them on the books as paye, therefore paying nat ins contributions for them and pay their tax for them and take all the liability away from them as "self employed" But the construction industry includes all trades like sparks joiners plummbers etc etc....so if your a spark and you use a self employed lad to help you all year round......youll have to take him on paye Link to post Share on other sites
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