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Any service is only worth what a client is prepared to pay for it. The only way to increase their perception of what it's worth is by selling it to them properly. A lot of people see salesmanship as a bit of a dirty word, but if you run your own business then it has to be an integral part of it in order to secure what you want for your services.

 

That may sound a bit rich coming from a part time DJ like me, but to refer back to an earlier point made, in my full time job, as a self employed electrician, I do have to sell my services, otherwise contrary to popular opinion I'd be losing all my work to off duty fireman, unqualified builders, or yes the aforementioned kitchen fitters.

Neil B

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i know some of us is upsetting you and you might be in difficult circumstances but you started the thread attacking all part timers.

 

Im not attacking part-timers at all.

Iam making a comfortable living from my business.

But the fact remains that with the ammount of part-timers their is not charging what they are worth I actually wonder why I bothered going full-time.......

Well actually no I dont wonder, Im earning as much as I did from when I was working full time, I dont have to get up to go to a boring job from 9-5 monday to friday AND I can devote 100% of my time and effort into providing the best service I can for my customers.

 

so before you were full time you were charging £150 kettle calling teapot black i believe(sorry if i miss read that bit)

 

Not at all......I dont charge more BECAUSE Im full time, but when I actually sat down and worked out hot much I was charging and how much I was spending I realised I needed to raise my prices.....and thats what I did, I didnt raise my prices because I became full time.

 

Fact is if most of you part timers actually worked out your expenses verses your incomes you would realise you needed to charge more too.......problem is how much profit your making dosnt make any difference.

 

It would seem that with the majority of people saying the same thing, then perhaps you could follow the advice from others and act upon your pricing structure

 

So lower my prices and have to do more gigs to earn the same money, yea that makes a lot of sense.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

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A nice lively thread - let's hope it stays that way (lively & nice smile icon )

IMHO i think the industry as a whole should move forwards as one to get a better deal for everyone full and part time alike by changing the clients perception of a "Mobile Disco" and the stigma associated but untill that time i will continue to charge what im worth and ignore what the so called "competition" charge.

 

Also the line about having to provide a bigger rig to charge more, thats a nonsense!.

 

I agree with these points.

 

On the other point of expenses - mine worked out at £148 per gig the last time I did it. Admittedly it was an exceptional year but nonetheless does show that I would be a naive businessman if I went out for £150 (or even £250 for that matter).

 

I'm full time by choice, I love what I do and I make a living from it. Some people even describe my life as one long holiday (they don't see the behind the scenes bits or that I work 7 days a week on some aspects of my business - not that I'm complaining, I do it because I like doing it).

 

Anyway back to the matter in hand. Even if tomorrow every DJ in the country decided to charge a higher rate for their services it wouldn't last long. Within months there will be people who see what can be earnt and jump on the bandwagon - only they will do it cheaper and we'll start all over again.

 

Which brings me back to my point - if you want to charge more you have to offer more (& I don't mean in equipment terms). In order to do this you have to find out what your customers want and then exceed their expectations which means researching your market and knowing everything there is worth knowing about it.

 

I specialise in the wedding market and as part of my 7 day working week I consult with brides and other people involved in the wedding business, I'm a member of several wedding forums where I listen to them (as well as offer the occasional advice) and my business has developed as a result.

 

OK Danno13 makes the point that you only need to be a better salesperson - obviously you do need to be able to sell your service better than your competitors but if, at the end of the day, you are only selling the same thing this can be a short term solution. If your service is 2nd to none then not only does it become easier to sell but other people will sell it for you too.

 

When you reach this stage your prices don't need to be competitive as price no longer becomes as big an issue ie clients want you for the service you can provide for them, they don't want anyone else and it's a done deal before a quote is even given.

 

The beauty of all this (as far as I'm concerned) is that you don't have to be the best DJ on the planet - it's other things that make a difference and it's up to each of us to find out what makes our clients tick, what presses the right buttons and what is important to them - um Market Research again I'm afraid smile icon

 

 

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Im not attacking part-timers at all.

Iam making a comfortable living from my business.

But the fact remains that with the ammount of part-timers their is not charging what they are worth I actually wonder why I bothered going full-time.......

Well actually no I dont wonder, Im earning as much as I did from when I was working full time, I dont have to get up to go to a boring job from 9-5 monday to friday AND I can devote 100% of my time and effort into providing the best service I can for my customers.

Not at all......I dont charge more BECAUSE Im full time, but when I actually sat down and worked out hot much I was charging and how much I was spending I realised I needed to raise my prices.....and thats what I did, I didnt raise my prices because I became full time.

 

Fact is if most of you part timers actually worked out your expenses verses your incomes you would realise you needed to charge more too.......problem is how much profit your making dosnt make any difference.

So lower my prices and have to do more gigs to earn the same money, yea that makes a lot of sense.

nick why would you even consider charging less if you are making a comfortable living, surely for you that would be going backwards, in my day job i wouldn't consider taking a pay cut so i could work more hours thats daft. if you are making a comfortable living then why worry so much about this one gig, read paul and dukesy's post carefully you will see us part timers really have no effect on what they charge . you really need to convince your clients you are worth more than the £150 disco and don't see how you can do that until you convince yourself.

 

quote nrg

I can devote 100% of my time and effort into providing the best service I can for my customers.

 

that is what your customers need tobe believing when they put down the phone, then they wouldn't be comparing your price to the guy at £150 because if he is part time he can't do that

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Quote Wayno:

"and even with 2 x £150 gigs a week that would only just cover my expences."

 

That amounts to over £15,000 a year, not allowing for extra work over the christmas period. That's a lot of expenses.

 

Yes Andy, please take the following the right way But the expences of part time Dj will be different to that of a Full time DJ and also with all due respect you dont seem to invest in a lot of new equipment or a lot of advertising (admittited in your own posts) which is quite right should this be how you want to run your interest, its not the way i choose, thats our deceision its not right or wrong.

 

And Paul totally agree with what you posted.

 

 

Sometimes in the pursuit of perfection one can get blinded by size.

 

If you believe you can acheive.

 

Add life to your days not days to your life.

 

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To me what I charge reflects on what the market i.e the customer will pay.

 

Personally I know that where I am if you quoted £225 9 times out of 10 you wouldn't get the job. If I get an enquiry that isn't through a recommendation/referal the first question every single time is "I want a disco how much".

 

I feel that I am probably worth more than I charge but if the market won't pay it then I can't charge it.

 

As far as slating part timers, I think its a bit slack. I use half decent gear, have a professional looking set up, use lasers and smoke, so why shouldn't I go out and DJ?

 

Just another thought on the "I can devote 100% of my time to providing the best service to my customer"

 

I did a 21st on Sat night and this is my contact with the customer:

 

Customer given my number and rings for quote

 

I tell her about what I do, give her a price and put her a brochure in the post

 

A few days later I call her, get any special requests, start/finish times etc make the booking and confirm everything in writing

 

1 week before I ring to confirm we will see them on Saturday

 

On the night of the gig run through times, cutting cake etc etc

 

 

What more could I have possibly done for this customer?

 

 

This was all done on an evening and probably took 30 mins max.

 

Plus as far as the mobile market goes, the majority of work is Fri and Sat night with the odd sunday/bank holiday, so what do full timers do the rest of the week? residencies?

 

 

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You can have the rest of the week off.... aside from doing paperwork, promoting the business, updating website, researching music, preparing music for the weekends gigs, researching the market, chatting on forums tongue out icon etc. I find plenty to do. I also go along to NADJ branch meetings at least a couple of times a month.

 

By the time i've done 3 gigs in a week and spent the time answering the phone and on all the admin etc. I'm almost up to a 40 hour week. Although, I don't have 3 gigs every week quite yet.. but its getting there!

Edited by Danno13

Revolution Discos - Covering Midlands and the Cotswolds - 01386 898 113 - 07791 261 263

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Danno just playing Devils advocate lol

 

If I do three gigs a week am I full time?

 

If you are putting in all that time and effort i.e. the equivalent of a 40 hour week and havent got 3 bookings a week is something wrong?

 

Researching music? As long as you keep up to date with the charts and the radio 1 playlists what else do you need to do?

 

Researching the maket? How exactly?

 

Updating the website? An hour a week at most I would have thought

 

 

 

 

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Thats exactly the thing that people should be factoring into their quotes....Its not just oh its a 4 hour disco.......add on an hour to setup and an hour to take down......an hour to travel too and an hour to travel back.......sudenly your 4 hour disco is now 8 hours.

So lets say you charge £160 for that.......still £20 an hour, thats a good wage for most people right?

But what about the hire of the equipment on top of the DJs time, you could not hire a disco kit for £160 for 4 hours and do the disco yourself let alone get a DJ and equipment for that money. But still Djs think its acceptable to only charge that ammount........and dont tell me you only charge that ammount coz thats all the customer will pay......customers will pay more.

 

And like Dan said, add up all the time you spend during the week doing anything related to your business........even part time your probably still talking 30 hours a week including time spent at gigs........after tax and expenses your probably not even getting the minimum wage.

 

nick why would you even consider charging less if you are making a comfortable living, surely for you that would be going backwards

 

Im considering charging less because my current conversion rate from enquirys to bookins is around 50%, I really want to increase that figuire as I have the capacity to take on more bookings than I do already, so in turn by charging less, I could actually be making more money.

Edited by NRG Roadshow
 

 

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Thats exactly the thing that people should be factoring into their quotes....Its not just oh its a 4 hour disco.......add on an hour to setup and an hour to take down......an hour to travel too and an hour to travel back.......sudenly your 4 hour disco is now 8 hours.

So lets say you charge £160 for that.......still £20 an hour, thats a good wage for most people right?

But what about the hire of the equipment on top of the DJs time, you could not hire a disco kit for £160 for 4 hours and do the disco yourself let alone get a DJ and equipment for that money. But still Djs think its acceptable to only charge that ammount........and dont tell me you only charge that ammount coz thats all the customer will pay......customers will pay more.

 

And like Dan said, add up all the time you spend during the week doing anything related to your business........even part time your probably still talking 30 hours a week including time spent at gigs........after tax and expenses your probably not even getting the minimum wage.

Im considering charging less because my current conversion rate from enquirys to bookins is around 50%, I really want to increase that figuire as I have the capacity to take on more bookings than I do already, so in turn by charging less, I could actually be making more money.

 

i don't like the argument you can't hire the equipment for those prices.i know it is a fact but the same goes for a lot of services,you get a builder in or anything and i bet you couldn't hire the equipment they bring in for the price they charge(tools of the trade).if they have to hire anything in it goes on the bill the same as if we hire in. thats just how i see that argument personally.

i don't think you are looking at this logically,if you are making a comfortable living what really is your problem.if you are charging 225 now ,if you do 1 gig a week you will get £11700. if you drop your prices to £150 to match that you have to do 78 gigs.so how many gigs will you have to do just to stand still if you drop your prices, also remember by doing more your expenses will go up(more paperwork,more wear and tear on equipment,more petrol) if i was full time i would be looking at putting my prices up not down and getting more for less. at the end of the day nick it is your bussiness so you have to do what is best for you,the same as all of us on here are doing,so you can charge as much or as little as you like

andy

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Customers will pay more???

 

I booked a weeks holiday last week and got talking to one of the girls in the travel agents and she's getting married later this year. So I asked if she had a DJ, no she hadn't but was in the process of doing so. So gave her the spiel and she said how much. I gave her a figure and she said the average price she had been quoted was £150.00.

 

So if I quote her £300 and say i'm really good and professional she's going to pay it???

 

 

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Customers will pay more???

 

 

So if I quote her £300 and say i'm really good and professional she's going to pay it???

 

she might not but the market is out there,some people won't care about the price if the service is right. but you have to be aiming in the right markets with the right service to get the right enquiries.some people on the other hand can't afford £200 for a dj so if they cant find one there is no party.

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Customers will pay more???

 

I booked a weeks holiday last week and got talking to one of the girls in the travel agents and she's getting married later this year. So I asked if she had a DJ, no she hadn't but was in the process of doing so. So gave her the spiel and she said how much. I gave her a figure and she said the average price she had been quoted was £150.00.

 

So if I quote her £300 and say i'm really good and professional she's going to pay it???

 

Possibly.... not all customers are price driven. If they have the budget and you can convince them you're worth £300 then you may well get it. For all you know, she might have been expecting to pay £500 for a DJ and quotes of £150 sound "too cheap to be any good".

 

We all do this in everyday life.. just last week I was in the market for a universal remote control, for convenience sake and also becasue my current ones are getting worn out.. anyway, when shopping around I immediatley discarded the sub £20 ones, as I didn't think they'd be any good.. I also didn't look at the £100+ ones as my budget didn't allow. I settled for one for £55 (Logitch Harmony 600 if anyone is interested, highly recomended!).

 

Ok, its an odd example, and is a product rather than a service, but I still think the same applies with our market.

Edited by Danno13

Revolution Discos - Covering Midlands and the Cotswolds - 01386 898 113 - 07791 261 263

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I do think at this point I ought to add that anybody who is running their own business and getting a decent living wage out of it for 40 hours a week investment ought to be extremely happy. There aren't many businesses you could do that.

 

Something else that may be a factor to some degree is the unsocial hours thing. When I started out, way back in the eighties, working on a Friday or Saturday night was considered unsocial hours, and heaven forbid having to work on a Sunday. However large swathes of the population now work across the weekend as a matter of course, so whilst people may have once expected to see a DJ earning well for working on his Saturday night, these days it's just another night for a lot of people.

Neil B

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Possibly.... not all customers are price driven. If they have the budget and you can convince them you're worth £300 then you may well get it.

 

 

that to me danno sums it up. you need to believe you are worth what you are charging and then be able to convince the client you are. in one of nrg's early post he says he is offering the same service as someone charging £150 that suggest's to me he as a problem with his service,later he say's being full time he can spend 100% of his time and effort on providing the best service for his customers. now that is what he needs to get across to his customers and how he can justify higher rates.he still won't win them all though and would be foolish to dwell on the ones he don't win. it's ok imo to ask yourself why you didnt get a party and try to work out if there is anything you could do better next time, but then move on with any lessons learnt.

andy

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Another interesting point is my old local pub.

 

Its a decent size, they have tribute acts on and the odd disco. I bumped into the landlady who asked me about doing one friday a month in there but she would only pay £120 as thats what she could get someone from the agency for!

 

If people on here can quote and get £300 jobs then fair play but I still find it a little hard to believe

 

 

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If people on here can quote and get £300 jobs then fair play but I still find it a little hard to believe

 

some people on her can get almost double that, it's about more than providing a disco i know some part timers who go out in excess of £200 a show they are not overcharging they are providing a service that warrants that

Edited by andyw
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Another interesting point is my old local pub.

 

Its a decent size, they have tribute acts on and the odd disco. I bumped into the landlady who asked me about doing one friday a month in there but she would only pay £120 as thats what she could get someone from the agency for!

 

I agree about pubs, there was a topic no so long ago on here that showed why pubs couldn't really afford to pay much for entertainment. This is why I don't work in them, and don't target them.

 

If people on here can quote and get £300 jobs then fair play but I still find it a little hard to believe

 

What I find hard to beleive is the fact that you think there aren't plenty of people in the 2nd biggest city in the UK that can afford £300 (and much more..) for a DJ!

Revolution Discos - Covering Midlands and the Cotswolds - 01386 898 113 - 07791 261 263

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Another interesting point is my old local pub.

 

Its a decent size, they have tribute acts on and the odd disco. I bumped into the landlady who asked me about doing one friday a month in there but she would only pay £120 as thats what she could get someone from the agency for!

 

If people on here can quote and get £300 jobs then fair play but I still find it a little hard to believe

 

 

From the point of view of anyone running a pub, a DJ is a cost. To justify it the takings must increase not only to cover that cost but to make more on top. £300 for a pub job does sound extremely unlikely

 

The point of view of a domestic customer will be quite different and the price paid will depend on the customers' perception of the DJ service.

 

Weddings are a different market but varied enough for not everyone to wish to pay the same.

 

My starting rate is in excess of the figure you mention and I have more weddings booked now for 2008 than I had booked for the whole of 2007 in July of that year. Not all bookings are in my local area and some are up to 100 miles away. The extra time and fuel involved is reflected in the price, in addition to the fee.

 

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So gave her the spiel and she said how much. I gave her a figure and she said the average price she had been quoted was £150.00.

 

And that is exactly the problem Im trying to highlight......thier are far too many "bob-a-job" discos around going out for silly money.........price will never get up to the proper rate until everyone starts charging a proper rate.

 

Danno has said a couple of time about some customer WANTING to pay more......well I had a conversation with a bride last week......

 

Usual phonecall that DIDNT start with "how much"....

Convo went on and I gave her the spiel about all the extra services I can provide and what I can do to make thier day special for them and she was very impressed....

I asked if she had got any quotes off other poeple and she said "yes, Ive had a few" so I asked how much they were quoteing, "round about £175"....this is for an evening reception from 7 till 12 with no extras.

I said Im sorry but I wont be able to quote as low as that and Gave her my price of £299........

And guess what......she booked me......now I wonder why she did that?

Do you think it could be that maybe just maybe not everyone is looking for a cheap disco and some are reasured by a higher price? Certainly seems like it to me.

Sure thats not true for everyone.....and thier are people wanting cut price discos, but if you regard your self as a professional business (whehter your full time or part-time) you should be charging a professional rate and leave the price fishers discos to the cowboys.

 

 

 

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Quote NRG:

"it could be that maybe just maybe not everyone is looking for a cheap disco and some are reasured by a higher price"

 

I think that must be true, which is how full-timers manage to get the high fees many of them charge.

 

However, (are we going round in circles??) there are many people who simply cannot afford these fees, and if there was no DJ option within the price range they could afford, they just wouldn't have the party.

 

This happens a fair bit with kids' discos, and I am aware of it happening with adult events too in my area.

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. . . Gave her my price of £299........

And guess what......she booked me......now I wonder why she did that?

I'm guessing she booked you because you made the sounds that she wanted to hear, and probably didn't hear from the others and was left with a much greater feeling of "confidence" about it all. And that was something she was willing to pay for.

 

I'd further guess that the higher price actually consolidated that confidence. So the higher price wasn't so much the reason for booking, but it reassured her that it was the right decision and that she'd get what she'd paid for.

 

However, the fact remains in all walks of retailing, and we are retailers in a sense, there are price focussed and there are quality focussed customers wherever you go. You just have to pitch it according to where you see your market.

 

Cue seductive music . . . cue seductive female voiceover . . . "atmosphere glowing, upwards from the floorboards till it trickles softly and lightly over the rafters, . . . wildly evocative fun, bringing each and every person closer and closer to a head swimming sense of euphoric ecstasy, . . . cool sounds of dance tunes moulded in time and steeped in sensational party traditions, . . . this isn't just a party DJ, . . . this is an M & S Party DJ"

<a href="http://www.djassociates.org"><img src="http://www.djassociates.org/anims/compres_banner.gif" alt="Join the DJ Associates Disc Jockey Association" border="0" width="468" height="60"></a>

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Does that include Twiggy in the package? :rolleyes:

 

And that is exactly the problem Im trying to highlight......thier are far too many "bob-a-job" discos around going out for silly money.........

 

Actually, I feel that this is a good subject for a new topic (quote) that you may wish to open in the non-public marketing area.

I feel this current thread is going around in circles and your point is slightly different to the question you posed.

 

Bringing this current thread subject to a close.

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